Keyless Cars can be fatal.............

steeve

Registered User
Difficult to believe but here goes any way..........................

A couple in New Zealand almost died after spending 13 hours locked inside their new car last month. Now they are speaking out about their ordeal to try and prevent other older drivers from suffering the same fate.

On the evening of November 5, Mollieanne, 65, and Brian Smith, 68, were in their keyless Mazda3 hatchback when they realized they had left their transponder key fob outside of the car. They didn't think the car could be unlocked without the fob. They also left the car's manual in the house.

They told the Otago Times that stress, the lateness of the hour and lack of information from the salesperson all contributed to trapping them in their new car for 13 hours.

Blaring the horn didn't help because of the fireworks from Guy Fawkes night. They also attempted to smash the window with a car jack, but it was no use.

The couple were freed at 7:45am the next morning by a neighbor. By then, Mollieanne was unconscious and her husband was having difficulty breathing. Attending physicians at the emergency room later told the couple that another half hour trapped inside could have killed them.

Brian had methodically checked for a way out of the car, but thought the only way to unlock the doors was with the key fob.

''Once I found out how simple it was to unlock it I kicked myself that I did not find the way out ... I had this mind-set that I did not have the transponder [so I could not get out]," Brian Smith told the Times.

Since going public the couple have heard from five other older car owners who have had similar experiences. The Mazda dealership the Smiths bought the car from told the Otago Times they will strive to better explain new technologies to older customers in the future.
 

Liquidfusion-S3

I fall to peer pressure!
They couldn't get out by smashing 'any' windows with a car jack?
Damn was it built using bullet proof glass?

I always been taught that to crack any glass you hit it at the weakest point which is the corner of the glass, you form a crack then smash it in the centre.

Bare the above in mind children!
 

nickatkinson

Registered User
Thread should be called stupid people can be fatal...classic! How about just unlocking the car from the inside? Some people....
 

Liquidfusion-S3

I fall to peer pressure!
There's an extra lock feature which doesn't let you unlock from the inside, this security feature was to prevent people smashing the window from the outside and unlocking it from the inside.

I read about this somewhere before where someone had the exact same problem.
 

jaypers777

Registered User
How about pressing the button to turn on the ignition and winding down the window?
 

cuke2u

Registered User
Doesn't have to be keyless, any car that has deadlocking, or double locking, can do this...
 

veeeight

I am a very pretty girl
VCDS Map User
Everyone should familiarse themselves with the emergency boot/hatch release mechanism, if you need to get out in the event of being deadlocked in, or no power.
 

cuke2u

Registered User
Yup, but the same people probably never check their tyre pressures, oil levels or know how to change a wheel...
 

Vertigo1

Registered User
You can't unlock the car from the inside if it's deadlocked.

Beware locking your loved ones and/or children in the car when you nip out to pay for fuel.



See:

http://www.audi-sport.net/xf/threads/locking-the-car.230126/

Ta for that link - the disabling of the interior sensors when disabling safelocking was news to me but makes perfect sense.

That could prove useful in a slight different way. During the summer when at work and the car is parked outside the office (i.e. in a pretty safe location) I sometimes want to open the windows an inch or two to allow a bit of air into the car so it's not an oven when I get in. I can do this from inside the office (can see the car out of the window) from the fob but then, when I lock the car again the interior sensors can sometimes be triggered by a breeze through the windows. Now I can disable them remotely :)
 

r6ymy

Registered User
Keyless Cars can be fatal.............
So can a kettle if you're terminally stupid, could have been a front runner for a Darwin award.
I don't have personal experience of a Mazda 3, but have had two keyless cars (Suzuki and Ford) and both wouldn't let you lock the car from the inside if the fob was outside.
 

Vertigo1

Registered User
Have to agree that this pair were obviously morons. Aside from not knowing how to get out, if you're so old and frail that you can't even break a window armed with a dirty great lump of metal then you shouldn't be driving as your reactions will likely be shot to hell too.
 

cuke2u

Registered User
That just about writes off every yaris owner then....
 

el-diablo675

Registered User
Opposite to this before Xmas a customer came into my shop saying there was a Volvo outside with engine running but no one in it. Anyway about half hour later an old guy probably 70 plus returns and we explain he had left his car running. He says the garage told him when he gets out it locks itself so he thought it turns off at same time.
God knows how many times he'd done it.
 

mfl

Registered User
yes and these are the same type of people who probably caused the 'unintended acceleration problem' on automatic cars and why cars these days have to be made more and more stupid proof.
 

veeeight

I am a very pretty girl
VCDS Map User
^ Yep there's an awful lot of very high horses at the moment ;)
 

veeeight

I am a very pretty girl
VCDS Map User
Question on Audi Advanced Key

You're in the driving seat, partner has car key in handbag/manbag.

You both get in. Car is started.

You drop off partner at the shops, and drive off. DIS beeps, and displays message about key not being in car.

You ignore message, carry on driving.

When you reach your destination, your switch off engine, whereby it won't restart. So far, all by design.

What happens if Start Stop had cut in before you reached your destination?
 

mjcourtney

Registered User
I'd guess that as the ignition is still "on" then it'd still restart the engine as usual?
 

veeeight

I am a very pretty girl
VCDS Map User
Would be good for someone to test this out for real :)
 

Vertigo1

Registered User
God forbid anyone here gets older and technology confuses them.

When that technology concerns the operation of car, then if I got to the point where its operation confused me I hope someone would relieve me of my driving licence!

"I'm sorry I mowed down those kids on the pedestrian crossing but I got confused and distracted trying to find Radio 4 and I'm used to a manual and this new-fangled automatic gearbox thing confused me with only two pedals and I didn't know which one to press and..."

Doddery old drivers are a menace and my biggest hate on the roads. All the press is so concerned with young drivers and "boy racers" (who can indeed be a menace) but there are far more dangerous old drivers on the road who have no idea what they're doing, where they're going or what's happening around them and have the reflexes of a sloth on valium.

I'm still a massive advocate of full driving re-tests every ten years - if you fail you lose your licence, end of.
 

veeeight

I am a very pretty girl
VCDS Map User
It's not exclusive to old people who manage to press both the accelerator and brake at the same time......

Accidents have happened because of oversized footwear and/or badly positioned pedals.

In this instance it would seem sensible for a nanny system to override the throttle.
 

r6ymy

Registered User
Re reading this, the people concerned were 65 and 68, that's not what I'd call old.
And age alone isn't the only factor, anyone, of any age, who doesn't understand how to control the vehicle they re in charge of shouldn't be driving it.

On veeights scenario of what happens if one person leaves the vehicle with the fob when the vehicle is running, we did that after collecting my wife's Fiesta after a service. I drove us both down in may car. Collected her car, I reversed it out into the road, left engine running, wife got in to drive home while I paid. Didn't realise she didn't have her key fob with her. Car stopped about half a mile up the road.
 

wideboybloke

Registered User
Reminds me of the story (possibly apocryphal) of the guy in the US who switched on the cruise control on his winibago and went in the back to make himself a cup of coffee. Following the crash, he apparently sued the dealer for not explaining how cruise control works
 

voorhees

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
When that technology concerns the operation of car, then if I got to the point where its operation confused me I hope someone would relieve me of my driving licence!

"I'm sorry I mowed down those kids on the pedestrian crossing but I got confused and distracted trying to find Radio 4 and I'm used to a manual and this new-fangled automatic gearbox thing confused me with only two pedals and I didn't know which one to press and..."

Doddery old drivers are a menace and my biggest hate on the roads. All the press is so concerned with young drivers and "boy racers" (who can indeed be a menace) but there are far more dangerous old drivers on the road who have no idea what they're doing, where they're going or what's happening around them and have the reflexes of a sloth on valium.

I'm still a massive advocate of full driving re-tests every ten years - if you fail you lose your licence, end of.
As I said god forbid anyone on this thread gets older
 

Vertigo1

Registered User
I know and my point is that older drivers can't be trusted to give up their licences when they become a danger to others so the system needs to change to do that for them and others.

I'm already far from a spring chicken but, looking forward objectively, I'd hope that if I became a dangerous elderly driver, the system would take my licence from me. I know that, when that time comes, there's a good chance that I wouldn't be able to look at myself and my driving ability objectively and may convince myself that I was fine because I wanted to continue driving. I feel there are far too many older drivers in that situation and whose licences should be taken away before we hear about them on the news, driving the wrong way up the motorway and killing someone.
 

mfl

Registered User
I know and my point is that older drivers can't be trusted to give up their licences when they become a danger to others so the system needs to change to do that for them and others.
.

In NSW (each state in Oz is different).

After you turn 75, a yearly medical review is required to keep your license.
If you have a bus/truck license after 70 you need to take a yearly license test and medical review, the yearly driving test for car or motorbike licenses doesn't apply till you turn 85.

They can also issue modified licenses which limit you to a certain distance from home or at certain times only
 

Vertigo1

Registered User
That sounds like at least some degree of common sense.

In the UK your licence lasts until you're 70, at which point you just apply for a new one and they issue it. No re-tests, no medicals, nothing. It's insane.
 

Dtwm1

Registered User
That sounds like at least some degree of common sense.

In the UK your licence lasts until you're 70, at which point you just apply for a new one and they issue it. No re-tests, no medicals, nothing. It's insane.
I have a friend that was knocked off his bike by a 91 year old. Once the police investigated the driver was "essentially blind" and had her license revoked there and then.

I agree there should be some sort of annual test at 70+ for example but no government it's going to pass it as a law as the oap vote it worth far too much.
 

cuke2u

Registered User
Question on Audi Advanced Key

You're in the driving seat, partner has car key in handbag/manbag.

You both get in. Car is started.

You drop off partner at the shops, and drive off. DIS beeps, and displays message about key not being in car.

You ignore message, carry on driving.

When you reach your destination, your switch off engine, whereby it won't restart. So far, all by design.

What happens if Start Stop had cut in before you reached your destination?
I think it should ask for a manual restart if the engine stops with the keys outside of the car. Thats what it use to do with my focus anyway. Its an additional security feature of keyless.

God this thread has become quite ageist, it is reported that the majority of incidents in cars are caused by younger drivers, not those over 60. As its my 60th birthday in november then maybe I should hand in my licence according to some?
 
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veeeight

I am a very pretty girl
VCDS Map User
I think it should ask for a manual restart if the engine stops with the keys outside of the car. Thats what it use to do with my focus anyway. Its an additional security feature of keyless


So if it does ask for a manual restart - and the key is in your other halfs handbag/manbag - you are stuffed at the traffic lights? If stop start kicks in, or you stall the car.
 

cuke2u

Registered User
It won't perform a manual restart without the key being present. Its a good idea as it means if somebody pulls you out of the car and the key is in your pocket the car will probably get as far as the next set of traffic lights. How often do you think your example will happen? Of course with a car that has a key, the thief can do what he or she wants...
 

veeeight

I am a very pretty girl
VCDS Map User
A quick google shows it happens more frequently than you make out ;)

I wasn't saying that it was a bad thing, I just wanted to know what the design behaviour is.

I wasn't really referring to a thief either, don't be paranoid about the inherently less secure features of Keyless - don't drag it into this thread, leave it for the mega Advanced Key thread ;)
 
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cuke2u

Registered User
Google is not really accurate as it will give a false impression...
 
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