Prawn and BigAls A3 Track Car

[snowy]

Use a single pad type all round, one with a performance you known well - it will be one less variable

Hopefully would allow you to concentrate of working bias balance, tyre pressures, etc

If you know DS3000 then that would be a good starting point

Their performance is also well known generally, so a known reference point if you're discusing the problem with others

View it as creating a new reference point to work from

 

[Prawn]

That's a great idea Snowy, and I agree 100%, but time and cost are fairly prohibitive. With Baby coming my track time is likely to be even less this year than usual, and my spare cash situation is likely to be equally reduced! I think i need to do my research, look at all my options, and try and make a best guess and go from there.

In an ideal world, I'd fit the same middle ground compounds front and rear, and swap up / down at each end until I found something suitable. But that'd cost a FORTUNE in brake pads!

One thing Ive just realised:

I have an old set of 1155 rears. they're fairly worn, but will work for testing purposes.

i also have a set of Pagid RS29's that have about 3-4mm on them.

Whilst neither of these are going to get me through a trackday, the 1155 rears would increase rear torque, and the pagid fronts are MUCH less grabby than the F2R's, so I might fit them and go for a drive somewhere quiet, and try and instigate a few lockups and see what happens, even if it's just to prove a theory.

 

[badger5]

RST3 I think mine are designated

 

[snowy]

Bigger discs are adding unsprung weight

just for info

Stock 256mm disk: 7kg

330mm bell/rotor: 6.5Kg

 

[superkarl]

just for info

Stock 256mm disk: 7kg

330mm bell/rotor: 6.5Kg

stock: £1

330: £1,000,000

 

[snowy]

Stock (+ oem pad): £60
Stock + decent pad: £265


330mm rear kit (bell+rotor+caliper carrier): £400
replacement rotors: £240

(probably carp pads included: hawk street or some such crud)

So 330mm setup + decent pad: £600

Replacement rotors and pads at the same time: £400ish from decent race suppliers

 

[Prawn]

pads arn't that bad to be honest. Stock sized discs are £60 a set for decent items, and decent pads are less than £100 really even for the more exotic stuff.

Of the kits I'd be looking at, they would be S4 cast discs in 300mm, which I think would weight a fair bit more than the 256's.

I've not seen a 330mm rear kit with 2 piece discs for £400, but in all honesty, I don't have £400 to spend on it any time soon.

It needs new pads front and rear, and I'm hopeful the balance can be addressed by choosing the next set of pads wisely, without spending a fortune!

it would be nice to spend a fortune of course, on cool shiney parts, but with baby due soon, it's about getting the car useable and enjoyable without spending the earth, as it'll likely not see too much use once baby is here, for a while at least!

 

[superkarl]

pads arn't that bad to be honest. Stock sized discs are £60 a set for decent items, and decent pads are less than £100 really even for the more exotic stuff.

Of the kits I'd be looking at, they would be S4 cast discs in 300mm, which I think would weight a fair bit more than the 256's.

I've not seen a 330mm rear kit with 2 piece discs for £400, but in all honesty, I don't have £400 to spend on it any time soon.

It needs new pads front and rear, and I'm hopeful the balance can be addressed by choosing the next set of pads wisely, without spending a fortune!

it would be nice to spend a fortune of course, on cool shiney parts, but with baby due soon, it's about getting the car useable and enjoyable without spending the earth, as it'll likely not see too much use once baby is here, for a while at least!

I've heard race cars are great for a childs development.
My mother was induced carrying me in my dads MK2 Mexico back in '88. I turned out alright superhero

 

[Prawn]

@Rich196 came up with an epic idea this week.

Rather than reading traditional bedtime stories to Baby Prawn at Bedtime, he suggested I read him the story of the track car from the very beginning!

Part of me thinks I should start printing off my updates from the very start and make it into a book to read to him complete with pictures

This thread will DEFINITELY contain pictures of baby prawn in inappropriate track car related places though, and I even have a free pass from Victoria to say I'm allowed to do so

Pad wise, I think I'm going to to with F4R fronts, a lower torque alternative to the F2's, and 1155 rears for now.

I'd love to experiment further with other brands etc, but I've had great results with Mintex over the last 3-4 years, and despite the similar RRP, the price I can get the F-series pads in my particular fitment is literally HALF that of the other brands.

if F4R's prove to be still to fierce, I'll try F6'r after that.

Of course, I could well find that come summer time, with warmer temps and newer tyres, the problem is considerably reduced anyway.

 

[Rich196]

@Prawn a printed book cannot contain videos! Can ebooks?

 

[Prawn]

Seems like a good excuse to joint the 21st century and get myself a tablet Rich!

 

[JsHarthill]

found this, uses standard rear caliper from r32/s3 and uses the 280mm standard front discs from the mk4/a3

https://www.bolt-action.nl/product/vw-mk4-280mm-rear-brake-adapter-kit-r32-s3/

 

[Prawn]

Well, what an interesting week it has been!

Earlier in the week I received a parcel:



Containing these:







These were very kindly donated by @JsHarthill . He had them for his S3, but decided they didn't suit it as a road car, which I'd probably agree was the right choice.

I don't know exactly how they'll look on the A3, but I think they could well fit in OK visually due to how the rest of the car looks. They're certainly much better from an aerodynamic point of view, and being plastic, and manual, they weigh almost nothing, so if nothing else I imagine I'll save 2kg from fairly high up, which has to be good.

Jamie also included some unexpected, slightly random, but very generous gifts in the box too!



As well as a very kind handwritten letter saying that if I do decide to sell the mirrors on, any money should go into a fund for Baby prawn.
What a top bloke! Things like that really do make you realise that there are still decent people out there, and we're not all completely doomed just yet.

He's also Scottish, and he GAVE me the mirrors, so bang goes that stereotype too - Jamie, thanks very much, I really appreciate it!



Going back to current issues,

A had 30 mins spare earlier in the week, so I coped by B5 and Bedford reports over onto another forum I use, which is fairly heavily motorsport orientated.

Someone asked about my brake plumbing, so I posted a few pics, and instantly got told that I'd plumbed my master cylinder in wrongly, with the front ports going to the front and rear brakes.

Now, I'd thought long and hard about this before installing, and decided that the way I did it was logical.

I hooked the front brakes up to the output in the very end of the master cylinder, on the logic that it was a fixed cylinder with a solid end, and therefore in my head, more reliable than the floating piston / cylinder arrangement that drives the other port nearest the servo end. This, at the time, seemed like sound logic, and in my VAG specific searching, I found no evidence to suggest otherwise.

With the rear line plumbed to the green line here, via the bias valve is how Prawn currently has it. When the bias valve is closed you effectively have a hydraulic lock in the master cylinder green area. This prevents the light spring compressing, effectively with a solid plug of fluid round it so all pedal effort pushes straight through putting the front brakes on. With the bias lever open the hydraulic lock effect is somewhat reduced, but still not right. So hard to type clearly. Much easier to verbalise.

He also rang me to explain fully, and whilst it confused me at first, it does make sense due to the way the springs are setup inside the MC.

Also, contrary to my prior belief, the stock ABS system is split front / rear, rather than diagonally as I had thought:

Great explanation Gareth!

Also, this image you linked to shows that my car actually wasn't plumbed with a diagonal split from the factory like I thought:

I will definitely be swapping them around when i get the chance.

Thanks all for the input too guys, the level of technical knowledge on here far outweighs the other forums I'm on!

I will report back findings as soon as they're swapped over

So, before I got involved with changing pad compounds and chasing my tail, a fundemental error has been identified.

I see no point in chasing this any further until these are swapped around, which I'm going to do asap, then go testing again!

 

[Rainbird]

Great stuff with the mirrors (top chap) and hopefully the brake setup goes someway towards sorting things out.

I sold my old K04 hybrid, Cobra exhaust and mani to a Scottish chap last year. Paid in Scottish £100 notes (which I didn't realise were a legit thing!) and threw in a bottle of rather expensive champagne too. Stereotype well and truly smashed!

 

[Prawn]

Having spent almost 9 months without the car, it's all too easy to actually forget it's fixed and forget to use it!

This dawned on my late on Saturday evening, as I wondered what I'd do with the first few hours of Sunday morning. A few messages later, and I was going for breakfast with Andy and Luke

0830 Sunday arrived and I dug the car out of the garage.



Id been profiling the back edge of a white laminate shelf in the garage on Saturday night (to fit our wonky walls )

I hadn't realised quite how bad the dust had been!



I set off to meet Andy on the way to the Cafe. I was a few minutes late leaving, and my phone was playing up so I hoped he'd be waiting for me.

I got to the meeting point on the a32, and no Andy. I waited 10 minutes, phone still not working, and decided to crack on. He was probably ahead of me anyway. Id meet him there.

I arrived at the cafe 20 mins late to find a very bored looking Luke. He did cheer up when I arrived though!


No Andy though!

Luke's phone wasn't working either. I think o2 forgot to set is alarm on Saturday night after a few beers and simply couldn't be bothered with Sunday morning!

20 minutes passed, and we decided Andy had clearly bailed on us, and either not bothered to tell us or the messages wernt getting through. So we ordered food.

We were just tucking into breakfast, when the waitress came out and said "do we have a Nick and a Luke in here? There's a phone call for you!"

Well, that's never happened before!

Of course, it was Andy. He'd broken down just 3 miles from the cafe, and limped into a side road.

He'd been trying to call Luke and I for over half an hour, but none of our phones were working

To add insult to hunger, I'd apparently driven past him half an hour earlier on my way out, but wouldn't have seen him where he'd limped off the main road

So, breakfast was inhaled at double speed, and it was back to the car!



5 minutes later we arrived at a stricken Andy on the road side:



Luke dug out the Japanese widow maker to lift the stranded Swede:



Whilst the German car owner laughed and took more pictures




With the wheel in the air nothing appeared to be wrong.

Andy had been experiencing a bizzare snagging at the front left and a snatching at the steering too, yet nothing seemed to be catching.

We jumped in and went very slowly down the road, and within 50 yards I was able to diagnose a dead inner CV joint. That's one area in which I have a particularly colourful depth of unwillingly acquired experience

With nothing a could do, the only option was to drive it home very gently with me following behind incase it went completely.

It didn't, and after an unusually long drive back we made it to a Andy's. Job done.

This is part of what I love about these cars. There is never a dull moment.
Whilst you could look on something like that as expense and hassle, it's all part of the adventure and just adds to the story!

Long may the fun continue!

 

[Lavis89]

I can't wait to get a track toy so i can have some adventures like this. My a3 used to give me some jip with the boost pipes blowing off but the s4 is too reliable (at the moment) for any shenanigans. I'm buying my new house and the main thing I've told the missus is that it needs off road space or a decent sized garage so i can build something stupid for track use

 

[Rainbird]

Nice to see it's not Das Audi eating CVs for a change mate. How's Ponty enjoying having the Red Baron back? Does he have plans in place for it (other than replacing the aforementioned...)?

 

[Prawn]

I think Ponty is enjoying having the RB back, although like mine at the moment, it doesn't get used as much as it should!

In other news, as much as I'd like to pretend I've got loads of time and money and I'm going to get loads done, I've had a bit of a realisation: I havn't, and I don't.

With that in mind, I've accepted that the change to 18'' wheels isn't going to happen this year. It requires a minimum of 2 sets of wheels and tyres buying, all brand new rims because of the size and offsets I want. On top of that there is a fair bit of bodywork required at both ends to get them to fit, as well as paintwork to follow that. It's just not about to happen overnight.

Sadly I've already sold my Bronze Rotas to Lewis (who's shifted them on already), and I've done a deal with Stacey on the white Rotas, so I'm down to just the OZ SuperT's, and a set of heavy TT 6 spokes! For the first time in years, I feel Wheelless!

So, with basically no road legal tyres left (the current A048's are very close to the wear bars), I needed to find some road going rubber for this year that would keep the car useable and fun.

As luck would have it, scouring facebook i found a set of brand new 235/40/17 NS2R's for a good price.

A cheeky offer was made, countered, and a deal was stuck!



I'm having the tyres stripped off today, then the OZs will be dropped off for shot blasting and powdercoating locally, before it all goes back on for a slightly smarter look.

I'm hoping the 235/40 tyres work well. They're a decent width, and will lower the car slightly from the old 235/45 khumos I've been using until recently. the decrease in sidewall height should give a nicer feel on turn in too, as it was noticably worse when using the taller Khumos. being NS2R they also come with 7mm of tread, making them ideal for my current needs in terms of lifespan.

Not ultimately what we wanted to be doing, but with legal tyre supplies running very low, we had to do something, and this seemed like the best option.

It also means the OZ's will be recently refurbed with decent tyres when we come to sell them at the end of the year

 

[scotty_24]

Interested to see what you think about the NS2R, Ive got them on mine. Served me well on the 'Ring, Croft and Knockhill.
Still got loads of tread too, I'd say 3/4 worn.
Ive only every drove on track these 3 times, and know no different to the S3 on NS2R on track.

My belief is that my talent will let go way before these tyres will in the dry....
They give me confidence as a novice track driver !

 

[Prawn]

Interested to see what you think about the NS2R, Ive got them on mine. Served me well on the 'Ring, Croft and Knockhill.

I'm not expecting them to be life alteringly brilliant. I've run mainly A048's and Dunlop 03G semis in the past, which are as good as semi slicks get.

These are a great compromise for something that'll see road use though. 7mm tread from new, not far off the top stuff in terms of outright grip, and a decent price.

Being 235/40 I'm hoping the extra width will go someway to make up the grip, and the low sidewalls should keen turn in nice and sharp too.

Also, new brake pads all round are on the way and I've got the fittings needed to swap the ports front to rear, so hopefully I'll be able to get access in there without having to move the engine!

I'm away this weekend, so I'll get onto the pipe swap one evening next week.

 

[<tuffty/>]

I have been running NS2r's for a while... currently 235/40 on the rear and 225/40 up front... when the fronts wear they will be replaced with 235's

I am not using them anywhere near on the edge like others but of all the tyres I have used the NS2r's have given me more confidence in the car but they do need a little heat in them to get useful and in fairness 30-40mph trips that I take to Bill's and back doesn't really push them...

I will say though that I never lose grip in dry conditions accelerating hard and in a straight line in the wet they just seem to hang on... only time I have really got them to light up is if I am over heavy on the foot exiting tightish corners in 2nd gear... but then they also light up in the dry in those instances to be fair..

<tuffty/>

 

[daz-20vt]

How was the evo on track?
Been eyeing them up recently

 

[Prawn]

It was pretty impressive to be honest. it's fairly well specced though, ~440bhp, 9.5" rims with 255 semi slicks, 2 piece brakes etc, so you'd expect it to be fairly handy!

It wasn't as dramatic as the A3, and wasn't as fast, but still good, if point and shoot is your thing

 

[daz-20vt]

Bet it felt good being back on track even with a few little issues

 

[Prawn]

It really did mate!

Aside from the brake locking, which we've established was my fault due to plumbing it wrong, the car was absolutely flawless. It smashed out about 160 track miles without missing a beat, and it was SO nice to be back on track. Its amazing how's it takes a short while to get back into a rhythm too. I'd say the afternoon laps were significantly faster than the morning sessions.

Hopefully with new pads and the brake plumbing issues addressed it'll be significantly better again

 

[Prawn]

Wheels are blasted!





They've now been dropped off to be powdercoated hope to have them back soon

 

[scotty_24]

What color we going for ?

 

[Erikn89nl]

They've now been dropped off to be powdercoated hope to have them back soon

As you said to me recently: You tart

 

[Prawn]

I'll let you out know the colour when I've decided if it looks any good or not Paul I'm hoping they'll be back this week some time

Spot what's changed:

 

[Erikn89nl]

You took a rattlecan to the bumper again!

I'm sure that's it...

Nothing to do with those silly wing mirrors...

 

[Rainbird]

If the rest of the car looked stock I don't think I'd like them at all, however it doesn't and I do. From that angle at least...

 

[Prawn]

If the rest of the car looked stock I don't think I'd like them at all, however it doesn't and I do. From that angle at least...

Currently, these are my thoughts too!

 

[Prawn]

So, the mirrors!

As mentioned earlier, these were very kindly given to me by Jamie, so as i had a few minutes spare at the weekend, I thought I'd throw them on for a test fit.

The first issue was the positioning of the base plates. I didn't get pictures, as it's hard to see, but I offered them into place, and slid them to their natural position, and went to screw in the fixing, only to find it didn't line up at all.

In order to get the fixing to line up, I had to slide them backwards about 10mm.

At this point, the front edge of the base plate didn't touch the inside of the door frame properly, and once screwed up, they were able to flex really easily.

Also, the fixing screws from baseplate to mirror were visible through the window on the trailing edge. it didn't look great at all.

With no simple way to alter the fixing on the mirror base, and no huge detriment to adding a small hole in the door frame, I measured carefully, and drilled a new hole in the door to allow the mirror to sit in the correct place. Further forward and lower down.



This then allowed the fixing hole to line up better when the mirrors were in their natural position:



I then cut up part of the original foam packer that sits behind the stock mirror to give it something to compress against when I tightened it down, and fitted them both.



Rolled outside into the light and they now fit fairly well I think.





It's very hard to make a decision on how they look. initial thoughts are, they are really different!

Were this a standard car, as Rainbird says, it'd be a no from me, as it was for Jamie on his S3.

That said, on my car, with the areo, and it's obvious intended purpose, I somehow think they actually work visually.

Weight wise, the saving wasn't quite as high as I imaged. less than 1kg in total, but every little helps still!

Rather than make up my mind instantly, I'm going to leave them on for a few months and see what I think of them, if they get any comments (positive or negative), then re-evaluate later on.

For now, I think it's a tentative thumbs up though!

 

[Prawn]

2 things:

1. it REALLY needs a proper clean. the dull matt look isn't doing much for me at the moment.

2. These wheels really do look great for some reason. They're in a strange flat off grey colour. Not a bright silver or a gloss colour at all really, they somehow make it look very dull.

Looking forward to getting the OZ's back soon!

 

[Rainbird]

1kg and a tiny aero improvement; those mirrors have to be worth 3s around Brands Hatch...

I'm currently sulking due to being able to afford a wheel refurb OR tyres but not both. You are making me a little envious with all this talk of shiny refreshed OZs you ******.

 

[Stuart B]

what's with your bonnet Prawn? is it wrapped or delaminating due to heat from manifold?

 

[Prawn]

It's old mate.

It's a carbon bonnet, and the laquer is peeling like crazy. It all needs flatting back and re-laquering, but that sounds expensive!

 

[Erikn89nl]

It all needs flatting back and re-laquering, but that sounds expensive!

Just rattle-can it, like your bumber!

 

[JsHarthill]

think thats why i might have thought they looked a bit odd, i bolted it on with the standard hole, they do suit your beast more with your aero mods on it.

 

[Prawn]

Well folks, it's been a quiet few weeks in the thread...

I pulled the car apart last sunday to sort the brake pipes, got stuck at the hospital all day monday with Victoria, worked flat out Tuesday and Wednesday, then, on Thursday life got turned upside down once and for all!

I'd like to proudly introduce, our son, Oliver Llywelyn Vaughan:




Little Oliver arrived last week in the very early hours of Friday morning, weighing just 6lb 4oz.

Victoria and Oliver are doing brilliantly, and we have been at home adjusting to our new lives since Saturday evening

After a few restless nights he's now adjusting to sleeping in his moses basket instead of in my arms, and I have to say I'm absolutely LOVING life as a Dad



We've even been out and shown him where he lives and had a stroll in the park:



and of course, I've started him young on the automotive education:



His early arrival does mean that the car is in bits, and I havn't had time to write up what I got up to before he arrived, but I'm sure when life settles down some more I'll get round to catching up with the rest of the thread.

For now though, I feel like I've got the best job in the world - Daddy Prawn!