Report RS3 TTRS brake problems

[Rocketer]

Hi guys,

In Holland we have a club of RS owners which have also a lot of troubles with the brakes. Especialy vibrating of the whole car when brakes are getting hot. As you all know the ventilation and cooling design of the RS is very poor.

To push Audi GMBH and our import compagny PON in the Netherlands to re-desgn the cooling of the disks and to push them to solve this issue under warrenty we have gathered a lot of RS drivers with this problem.

We have tipt www.autoblog.nl about the problem and that we do not get any solution or update of Audi.

This is the article : http://www.autoblog....n-stikken-91309

And the extended article and update of the first one is this : http://www.autoblog....h-bij-ons-91359

The second article is writen because there where a lot of reactions on the first article of RS drivers with this brake problem.

I hope you can read the dutch language with google translate well.

But my guestion is to all of you with the same b rake problems, to email the editorial office of autoblog.nl to this email:

Tips@autoblog.nl

You can send them a simpel email in English with a few details:
1. Your name?
2. Residence and country?
3. What kind of Brake problem.?
4. Milage of your RS3 or TTRS when the problem arose.?
5.Age of car when the problem arose.?
6. If you dealer tried to solve the problem?
7. Under warrenty of not?
8. Is the problem solved or not?

We will appreciated a lot when you send your comment!! And with your comment we can push Audi to speed up the re-design of the problem and fix an update on our beloved RS car. So indirectly you will have bennefit of it... ;-)

A lot of thanks in advance of all the dutch RS drivers

 

[Rocketer]

It`s from another RS3 forum so many has seen it already but better to get as much problem cars/owners as we can to see how big the problem is in numbers?

 

[45bvtc]

And ON it goes....

For the record: purchased new in October 2011 an 8P RS3, note the 8P as if it makes any difference and for sure it doesn't:

3rd February 2012 @ 1315-miles: reported seriously loud low-speed brake squeal to Stafford Audi; as mine was one of the first RS3s their response of "we've never heard of that before, sir" was not expected and their offer to 'clean' non-convincing so away I applied successfully my own 'fix' with Mintex self-adhesive anti-squeal shims

Applied the same 'fix' successfully to a fair number of other RS3 and TTRS owner cars and fully sorted

23rd September 2013 @ 5921 mile: reluctantly I agreed (with Martin Sander MO of Audi UK) to a 47i6 upgrade and ensured the brake-pad bedding-in procedure was properly undertaken

7th February 2014 @ 6825 miles: Low speed brake squeal returns so applied CeraTec to the back of all 4-pads and the brake squeal is less but has not gone altogether

17th February 2014 @ 7105 miles: fit Brembo anti-squeal shims with CeraTec and problem 100% resolved

9th May 2014 @ 7485 miles: other owners report disc 'damage' with OEM pads and checking my own OEM pads see 'rivets' holding the friction material to the back-plate and decide to change the brake pads for EBC Redstuff

15th May 2014 @ 7605 miles: Redstuff fitted and brake-pad bedding-in procedure properly undertaken and what a difference, even the long brake pedal characteristic of the 47i6 upgrade has gone

28th March 2016: STILL running EBC Redstuff, no way are OEM pads going anywhere near my car

 

[monkeyboy_marcus]

And ON it goes....

For the record: purchased new in October 2011 an 8P RS3, note the 8P as if it makes any difference and for sure it doesn't:

3rd February 2012 @ 1315-miles: reported seriously loud low-speed brake squeal to Stafford Audi; as mine was one of the first RS3s their response of "we've never heard of that before, sir" was not expected and their offer to 'clean' non-convincing so away I applied successfully my own 'fix' with Mintex self-adhesive anti-squeal shims

Applied the same 'fix' successfully to a fair number of other RS3 and TTRS owner cars and fully sorted

23rd September 2013 @ 5921 mile: reluctantly I agreed (with Martin Sander MO of Audi UK) to a 47i6 upgrade and ensured the brake-pad bedding-in procedure was properly undertaken

7th February 2014 @ 6825 miles: Low speed brake squeal returns so applied CeraTec to the back of all 4-pads and the brake squeal is less but has not gone altogether

17th February 2014 @ 7105 miles: fit Brembo anti-squeal shims with CeraTec and problem 100% resolved

9th May 2014 @ 7485 miles: other owners report disc 'damage' with OEM pads and checking my own OEM pads see 'rivets' holding the friction material to the back-plate and decide to change the brake pads for EBC Redstuff

15th May 2014 @ 7605 miles: Redstuff fitted and brake-pad bedding-in procedure properly undertaken and what a difference, even the long brake pedal characteristic of the 47i6 upgrade has gone

28th March 2016: STILL running EBC Redstuff, no way are OEM pads going anywhere near my car

John (45bvtc) you will laugh but yesterday in the new 2016 8V I got brake squeal for the first time in years. Guess what, dry conditions, slowly stopping at lights/parking etc. Sound familiar?!

 

[elton121272]

G

John (45bvtc) you will laugh but yesterday in the new 2016 8V I got brake squeal for the first time in years. Guess what, dry conditions, slowly stopping at lights/parking etc. Sound familiar?!

Groundhog Day all over again eh ;-). My 8V goes in tomorrow for brake squeal so will be interesting to see any comments and resolves....will naturally share outcomes.

 

[monkeyboy_marcus]

G

Groundhog Day all over again eh ;-). My 8V goes in tomorrow for brake squeal so will be interesting to see any comments and resolves....will naturally share outcomes.

Totally mate, couldn't believe what I was hearing, especially after finding all these nice little refinements that have improved the car over the previous model and now this. I've not had a careful look at the calipers - do they have the bobbins? We know there is a fix - EBC redstuff with self-adhesive anti squeal shims but really hope its not left to the user to fix and also hope this doesn't turn into the same fiasco we had in 2012-13. No doubt the dealerships and Audi UK will have a new crop of muppets who've never come across this and will talk ******** about it being a feature rather than a flaw. Look forward to your feedback!

 

[45bvtc]

John (45bvtc) you will laugh but yesterday in the new 2016 8V I got brake squeal for the first time in years. Guess what, dry conditions, slowly stopping at lights/parking etc. Sound familiar?!

G

Groundhog Day all over again eh ;-). My 8V goes in tomorrow for brake squeal so will be interesting to see any comments and resolves....will naturally share outcomes.

Not wanting to get into 8V RS3 brake squeal but much has already been posted by others with the effective resolution being Redstuff and for me that's zero surprise, however, if you want to keep everything OEM then I respectfully suggest you try Mintex/EBC/Bremtech self-adhesive anti-squeal shims first as they're easy to cut to shape, easy to affix to the back of the brake pad, and easy to remove if they don't work - but I'm betting they will - and they'll not affect warranty.

See eBay item 291458291665 or 231589276066

I believe the 8V RS3 brake caliper does have 'absorbers' but I didn't find them effective on the 47i6 8P RS3 brake calipers anyway: I removed mine on day one, waited for the low-speed brake squeal to begin, and then re-fitted the 'absorbers' so as to gauge any improvement and there was none!

But again the characteristics of the 8V RS3 brake squeal is exactly the same as that of the 8P RS3 in as much as some cars suffer and others don't: the big issue with the 8P OEM pads was the rivets (holding the friction material to the backplate) that as the pad wore down began to score the brake disc, not nice.

Good luck with sorting the issue guys

 

[andyt99]

Sorry if this has been covered, but how does the shim pad thing help with the brake squeal?

 

[45bvtc]

Sorry if this has been covered, but how does the shim pad thing help with the brake squeal?

Low speed brake squeal is created by the brake piston vibrating on the brake pad back-plate and most reputable brake pads have a 'soft' shim pre-bonded to the backplate, however, once that's worn through and has been typical of RS3/TTRS issue then you get low-speed brake squeal: putting a 'cushion' between back-plate and piston (even a smear of CeraTec or Copperslip) will change the 'squeal' characteristics.

Here's one of my 8P RS3 brake pads @ 1200 miles with low speed brake squeal, and you can see where the pistons have worn through the pre-bonded material:



Hope this helps but I really don't want to get into all of this again as soooooo much has been listed here previously (from me since February 2012 when mine first started) in the 8P section; like I say I don't have an 8V RS3 but the issue is the same as a couple of owners here can readily testify

 

[monkeyboy_marcus]

Low speed brake squeal is created by the brake piston vibrating on the brake pad back-plate and most reputable brake pads have a 'soft' shim pre-bonded to the backplate, however, once that's worn through and has been typical of RS3/TTRS issue then you get low-speed brake squeal: putting a 'cushion' between back-plate and piston (even a smear of CeraTec or Copperslip) will change the 'squeal' characteristics.

Here's one of my 8P RS3 brake pads @ 1200 miles with low speed brake squeal, and you can see where the pistons have worn through the pre-bonded material:

View attachment 104857

Hope this helps but I really don't want to get into all of this again as soooooo much has been listed here previously (from me since February 2012 when mine first started) in the 8P section; like I say I don't have an 8V RS3 but the issue is the same as a couple of owners here can readily testify

John, appreciate all the effort you made last time to resolve this in 2012-13 and can understand why you don't want to become involved again. Any chance of posting a link to your most helpful step by step tutorial/fix again?

 

[45bvtc]

John, appreciate all the effort you made last time to resolve this in 2012-13 and can understand why you don't want to become involved again. Any chance of posting a link to your most helpful step by step tutorial/fix again?

Here you go Marcus (5-pages) but for all others please note this procedure is for the 8P RS3 brakes and NOT the 8V RS3

 

[andyt99]

Wow, that's brilliant. Thanks for the explanation. I have this problem consistently. I've had new brake pads on and it was doing it again about 500 miles later. :-(

 

[45bvtc]

Wow, that's brilliant. Thanks for the explanation. I have this problem consistently. I've had new brake pads on and it was doing it again about 500 miles later. :-(

Believe it or not andyt99 the 8P caliper is used on the EVO and Impreza and others and Brembo do a stainless steel anti-squeal shim (Brembo 98.5032.40 (Mitsubishi MR475618) to resolve this self same issue on them other cars but Audi UK/GmbH, bless 'em, totally disregard the item.

Than again, this stainless steel shim is doing exactly the same as a self-adhesive anti-squeal shim and those are a do-it-yourself item off eBay.

But I'm EBC Redstuff front and rear and find them perfect for road-use.

 

[Spaceman_RS3]

Guys with 8v squeal do you have auto hill hold and do you use it?

my brakes have behaved well so far if they even think about squealing I pressure wash the discs and make sure all the drill holes are clear and hey presto no squeal.

 

[monkeyboy_marcus]

Here you go Marcus (5-pages) but for all others please note this procedure is for the 8P RS3 brakes and NOT the 8V RS3

View attachment 104863 View attachment 104864 View attachment 104865 View attachment 104866 View attachment 104867

Much appreciated John. Reckon I might just have a go myself, rather than waste time with the dealer/Audi UK like last time. Is the process likely to be much the same for the 8v (you specifically make the distinction)?

 

[monkeyboy_marcus]

Guys with 8v squeal do you have auto hill hold and do you use it?

my brakes have behaved well so far if they even think about squealing I pressure wash the discs and make sure all the drill holes are clear and hey presto no squeal.

No I don't think I have/use auto hill hold. I've also cleaned out the drill holes in the old car and still got the squeal. It seems to be very dependant on climatic factors, notably warm/dry... Interestingly on both 8p and 8v the squeal was noticeable within the first few thousand miles.

 

[45bvtc]

Much appreciated John. Reckon I might just have a go myself, rather than waste time with the dealer/Audi UK like last time. Is the process likely to be much the same for the 8v (you specifically make the distinction)?

The process will be similar, Marcus. Remove the pins and spring plates and bridge piece and then the 4-pads; cut the self-adhesive anti-squeal shim to shape and apply; and then re-fit: and then throw away the ear plugs...

 

[Hal Adams]

...just to be pedantic, I would add that you will notice the pads on the 8V are in four pieces - ie two pads per side of disc - be sure that you have all the pads in place when you lever them back to release the pistons. Do not do this with one pad not in place as all that will happen is that the free pistons will extend and could pop out!

 

[monkeyboy_marcus]

Just fitted the self-adhesive anti-squeal shims to both front brakes. Off eBay for about £20.00 - all is quiet again.

Couple of things to note: Hal - correct in that there are four pieces to the pads/per brake, i.e. two "kits" required for the front. I did replace them independently and manipulated the pistons each time to do so (nothing popped out thankfully!); 45BTVC - your instructions (link above) are still accurate for the 8V and make excellent reference material. Only thing I didn't do was remove the wear sensor as I couldn't see how and was able to remove the pad anyway. As you noted, some of the pads (lower) are very tight and had to be gently tapped out.

Overall, this was very straightforward and anyone should be able to do it themselves. Only things I had to research were that the supplied jack fits into a pinchweld adjacent to a mark below the door and that the wheel nut torque should be about 120nm.

 

[Swipe18]

Hi guys, new to the forum's but thought I would chip in on the old brake issues as i got a second hand rs3 8v a few months back and have just had all new discs and pads fitted all round by my local audi dealer as I had a judder which I told them was the front discs being warped. Took a couple of weeks but they finally replaced them!
Whats the best way to make sure it doesnt happen again? Is it a case of getting rid of the wavy's and going to something else?
Cheers

 

[45bvtc]

Just fitted the self-adhesive anti-squeal shims to both front brakes. Off eBay for about £20.00 - all is quiet again.

Couple of things to note: Hal - correct in that there are four pieces to the pads/per brake, i.e. two "kits" required for the front. I did replace them independently and manipulated the pistons each time to do so (nothing popped out thankfully!); 45BTVC - your instructions (link above) are still accurate for the 8V and make excellent reference material. Only thing I didn't do was remove the wear sensor as I couldn't see how and was able to remove the pad anyway. As you noted, some of the pads (lower) are very tight and had to be gently tapped out.

Overall, this was very straightforward and anyone should be able to do it themselves. Only things I had to research were that the supplied jack fits into a pinchweld adjacent to a mark below the door and that the wheel nut torque should be about 120nm.

That is GOOD news, Marcus, thank you...

I'm 100% sure you'll not be hearing low-speed brake squeal again with those self-adhesive anti-squeal shims fitted, such an easy 'fix'.

And yes, wheel bolt Torque is 120Nm or 88.5 lbf.ft

 

[45bvtc]

Hi guys, new to the forum's but thought I would chip in on the old brake issues as i got a second hand rs3 8v a few months back and have just had all new discs and pads fitted all round by my local audi dealer as I had a judder which I told them was the front discs being warped. Took a couple of weeks but they finally replaced them!
Whats the best way to make sure it doesnt happen again? Is it a case of getting rid of the wavy's and going to something else?
Cheers

For road use then fit EBC Redstuff brake pads front and rear and you'll have none of the usual issues caused by the OEM pads. I've been using and recommending them for 4-years now, Swipe, and for sure I've zero brake problems:

I find Redstuff very disc friendly unlike those OEM items of either 8P or 8V variants

 

[Spack]

Do the redstuff pads just fit straight on with the OEM wear inductor plugs?

 

[Spaceman_RS3]

No need to cut old ones off and splice with redstuff pad if you get rs4 ones. Or bypass the sensor.

 

[Swipe18]

For road use then fit EBC Redstuff brake pads front and rear and you'll have none of the usual issues caused by the OEM pads. I've been using and recommending them for 4-years now, Swipe, and for sure I've zero brake problems:

View attachment 111270

I find Redstuff very disc friendly unlike those OEM items of either 8P or 8V variants

Much appreciated!!! But now im confused. Do i need to order redstuff for rs3 or for rs4 to fit with the wear sensor?

 

[45bvtc]

Swipe, with respect: the wear sensors are on the nearside brake pads ONLY and now't on the offside. Audi, bless 'em, expect you to 'see' the brake pad thickness through them open 5-spoke wheels and I most certainly can as shown in the image in post #22 above.

I do not need a little bleeper to tell me that my brake pads need replacing as I can see 'em.

My own car has STD pads and 4-years ago I modified (soldered the two wires together within and insulated ) to suit:



And I visually inspect the thickness of the exposed brake pads (front and rear) every time I wash the wheels.



Hope this helps and cuts your costs (£s)

 

[Spaceman_RS3]

Much appreciated!!! But now im confused. Do i need to order redstuff for rs3 or for rs4 to fit with the wear sensor?

Don't think ebc list red stuff for the 8v rs3?

 

[45bvtc]

Don't think ebc list red stuff for the 8v rs3?

Here yo go Spaceman_RS3, same as:

 

[Hal Adams]

And for the rear:
DP32173C

 

[Spaceman_RS3]

Here yo go Spaceman_RS3, same as:

View attachment 111340

Cheers BT

They are the ones I read the guy above a post as should he order rs3 or rs4 ones meaning he had seen rs3 ones listed. Also r8 ones fit too

 

[45bvtc]

Cheers BT

They are the ones I read the guy above a post as should he order rs3 or rs4 ones meaning he had seen rs3 ones listed. Also r8 ones fit too

SAD to say but Redstuff does solve the silly issues experienced by some with OEM Brembo/Pagid pads; never had a come back after fitting Redstuff to a TT RS or RS3 (for road use) and I've done a fair few.

 

[Swipe18]

Here yo go Spaceman_RS3, same as:

View attachment 111340

cheers! will that come with all 8 pads or just 4? so need two sets?

 

[Hal Adams]

8 per set.

 

[45bvtc]

Just fitted the self-adhesive anti-squeal shims to both front brakes. Off eBay for about £20.00 - all is quiet again.

Couple of things to note: Hal - correct in that there are four pieces to the pads/per brake, i.e. two "kits" required for the front. I did replace them independently and manipulated the pistons each time to do so (nothing popped out thankfully!); 45BTVC - your instructions (link above) are still accurate for the 8V and make excellent reference material. Only thing I didn't do was remove the wear sensor as I couldn't see how and was able to remove the pad anyway. As you noted, some of the pads (lower) are very tight and had to be gently tapped out.

Overall, this was very straightforward and anyone should be able to do it themselves. Only things I had to research were that the supplied jack fits into a pinchweld adjacent to a mark below the door and that the wheel nut torque should be about 120nm.

SO RIGHT it needs saying AGAIN: if you do NOT want to fit alternatives then please just fit/apply a set of self-adhesive anti-squeal shims to your original OEM brake pads - similar posts going back some 5-years now. get 'em on eBay and fit 'em yourself, it ain't hard.



Get 2-sets and you'll have some left over and/or to correct any fitting error - just sayin'

 

[Swipe18]

Hey guy's, just thought I would mention. Had a voice mail from my local audi today/yesterday saying that audi uk were wanting/willing to change my discs again for new ones as the right hand side had warped within 1500-2000 miles. BUT.... the new ones they will be putting on are round and not the wavy design ( same as someone else on here got ) so...... does that mean they are finally starting to aknowledge something is wrong? But I believe the round ones are still all drilled left handed which means problem isnt fixed. But ive got my brand new set of red stuff pads sat waiting for new discs.

 

[45bvtc]

Hey guy's, just thought I would mention. Had a voice mail from my local audi today/yesterday saying that audi uk were wanting/willing to change my discs again for new ones as the right hand side had warped within 1500-2000 miles. BUT.... the new ones they will be putting on are round and not the wavy design ( same as someone else on here got ) so...... does that mean they are finally starting to aknowledge something is wrong? But I believe the round ones are still all drilled left handed which means problem isnt fixed. But ive got my brand new set of red stuff pads sat waiting for new discs.

As said previously I could never, ever see the point of wavy discs on road cars - and so it now seems. Get the 'round' ones fitted Swipe and then your Redstuff pads - too simple for words...

 

[Swipe18]

Ive mentioned on another forum but thought id copy and paste here

So, poped in today to book it in. They said that it is a problem with heat into the wavy discs! And wavy discs will continue to do this depending on driving style. Some will have the problem and others wont. Mines booked in next week to have the round discs put on which are drilled and can take higher temps. I said but the wavy's are drilled to which they kinda did that head to the side tilt with a 'weelllll'. So not sure what that means. Thats what Ive just been told so there you are...... and audi uk are covering the costs.

 

[Rocketer]

Ive mentioned on another forum but thought id copy and paste here

So, poped in today to book it in. They said that it is a problem with heat into the wavy discs! And wavy discs will continue to do this depending on driving style. Some will have the problem and others wont. Mines booked in next week to have the round discs put on which are drilled and can take higher temps. I said but the wavy's are drilled to which they kinda did that head to the side tilt with a 'weelllll'. So not sure what that means. Thats what Ive just been told so there you are...... and audi uk are covering the costs.

You are lucky then if they cover the cost . The main problem with two leftys is that the cooling channels in disc are curved if they should be straight there wouldn't be any problem. There are articles out on the net explaining this with pictures and everything, really easy to understand and if you see its just crystal clear except Audi themselves ):. How hard can it be?

 

[45bvtc]

Ive mentioned on another forum but thought id copy and paste here

So, poped in today to book it in. They said that it is a problem with heat into the wavy discs! And wavy discs will continue to do this depending on driving style. Some will have the problem and others wont. Mines booked in next week to have the round discs put on which are drilled and can take higher temps. I said but the wavy's are drilled to which they kinda did that head to the side tilt with a 'weelllll'. So not sure what that means. Thats what Ive just been told so there you are...... and audi uk are covering the costs.

Well done you for posting, Swipe18. But c'mon; having had a face-to-face with the then MD of Audi UK about RS3 'silly' brake issues - and Martin went back to Audi GmbH to review my thoughts/offerings/resolutions - I do think that a LOAD of the proverbials.

The RS3 is a road car. The RS3 is sold as a road car. The RS3 is not designed as a track car - you want track car brakes then that's another issue.

I've had my hands on so many RS3's now and NONE, when re-fitted with EBC Redstuff brake pads with STD brake discs both round and wavy continue with ANY of reported brake issues.

The RS3 is a low volume car. The RS3 is currently non-production. Any noises a customer can make are nothing compared with other Audi/VW issues. Audi UK only respond to Audi GmbH. Audi UK will provide FREE service if you pester but they won't solve the underlying problem.

Some RS3 cars have a reportable brake issue problem. Others don't; and I mean they just don't! I still can't fathom it but they just don't!

It is an interesting one but for sure EBC Redstuff brake pads - and EBC UK don't recommend 'em as a 1 to 1 swap - are a sure fire fix.

None of the above makes any sense! I know. I've a RS3 brake issue head ache. But MY RS3 doesn't have a brake issue.

I do practice what I preach and have EBC Redstuff brake pads fitted front and rear on my own Audi RS3 and I love 'em; and have zero OEM brake pad issues...

Just sayin'

 

[Swipe18]

Well done you for posting, Swipe18. But c'mon; having had a face-to-face with the then MD of Audi UK about RS3 'silly' brake issues - and Martin went back to Audi GmbH to review my thoughts/offerings/resolutions - I do think that a LOAD of the proverbials.

The RS3 is a road car. The RS3 is sold as a road car. The RS3 is not designed as a track car - you want track car brakes then that's another issue.

I've had my hands on so many RS3's now and NONE, when re-fitted with EBC Redstuff brake pads with STD brake discs both round and wavy continue with ANY of reported brake issues.

Well Ive never used mine on a track, I drive to and from work which is basically a straight road for 60 miles with the odd round about. Just because YOU havent had any issues doesnt mean the problem doesnt exist.
Like I said, ive been told by audi yes there is a problem with the wavy discs and warping due to heat. The round discs are good for higher temperatures which is what they will be fitting. They admit there is a issue in my eyes then. They are saying down to external influeneces but like I said Ive not been on a track or driven it stupidly hard. I reckon if you had to do a emergency stop on a motor way hard on the pedal that alone would distort the front right disc.
Any way..... im sorted ( for now ) so happy days