S1 Stage 1 Remap with Organic Clutch - Does it Ruin the Drive?

[yogiemoji]

Hi Audi-sport folks,
Hope you are all well.
TL;DR: Does a helix organic clutch ruin the drive in an S1?
I'm interested in buying an Audi s1, the one I've found has had a remap and a clutch replacement to a helix organic clutch. The dealer insisted that I tell my brother (who will be the owner) that the clutch is a heavy sports clutch. I spoke online with a remap company to find out about the remap (didn't really want a tuned car if it causes issues later on), he said the remap was a well-established tune with no issues. However, he said that the helix organic clutch would pretty much ruin the drive if it's an everyday usage car - which it will be. Will this heavy clutch ruin the drive?
Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you.
Kind regards,
Yogi
PS it also has 'Eibach springs' and 'EPC brake pads' (I think he meant EBC) are these good additions to the car?
Both seem okay from a quick google search...

 

[Phazer]

The uprated Sachs clutch will be fine. A little heavier than normal but nothing to worry about.
If it were the paddle clutch then yes I'd agree, they're more difficult to use in traffic and I'd suggest driving a car with one before having this type fitted as they're very very different.

Eibach springs are fine. EBC used to have a terrible reputation years ago, no idea if they've improved but not the end of the world to change if you don't like them,

Most important things to check really are that the car has been looked after and not chavved to death. Make sure the haldex has been serviced regularly and preferably properly - pump out and gauze cleaned.

Who's it been remapped by?

 

[yogiemoji]

The uprated Sachs clutch will be fine. A little heavier than normal but nothing to worry about.
If it were the paddle clutch then yes I'd agree, they're more difficult to use in traffic and I'd suggest driving a car with one before having this type fitted as they're very very different.

Eibach springs are fine. EBC used to have a terrible reputation years ago, no idea if they've improved but not the end of the world to change if you don't like them,

Most important things to check really are that the car has been looked after and not chavved to death. Make sure the haldex has been serviced regularly and preferably properly - pump out and gauze cleaned.

Who's it been remapped by?

Thank you for your detailed reply! That helps a lot!

The last service from audi was in 2018, how would I know when the last haldex service was (is this the alternative to quattro)?
I think APR did the remap.

 

[Phazer]

Thank you for your detailed reply! That helps a lot!

The last service from audi was in 2018, how would I know when the last haldex service was (is this the alternative to quattro)?
I think APR did the remap.

No worries.

Haldex *is* the Quattro. You should be able to see it on myAudi on the service records if it's been done at Audi. They suggest 3 years/30000 miles but it should really be done every year and crucially, they won't remove the pump and clean the gauze so you'll need to see a specialist. If you don't your pump will fail. Otherwise the owner should be able to produce a receipt for the work.

APR is solid for the map so that's good.

 

[yogiemoji]

No worries.

Haldex *is* the Quattro. You should be able to see it on myAudi on the service records if it's been done at Audi. They suggest 3 years/30000 miles but it should really be done every year and crucially, they won't remove the pump and clean the gauze so you'll need to see a specialist. If you don't your pump will fail. Otherwise the owner should be able to produce a receipt for the work.

APR is solid for the map so that's good.

Thank you @Phazer, I spoke with APR and they said that they gave the software but didn't add it to the car, so another unknown garage would have completed the mod.

Just out of curiosity, what would you say is better, in the long run, a 2014 s3 or the 2014 modded s1? An Audi dealer said that new s1's will no longer be Quattro- will be front-wheel drive- so that makes me think this s1 will hold its value better, but the s3 is bigger; both have satnav & Bluetooth, neither have cruise control.

 

[yogiemoji]

Is this pump change you mean, the "Oil for all-wheel drive coupling"?

 

[Phazer]

The S1 is more fun than the S3. Outside of that it depends what you want from a car? I'd try and buy newer in both than 2014 though to be honest. Later S1's have more kit as standard and some parts revisions in the running gear that may save money in the longer term. Don't pay for the modifications, they don't increase the value - if the car is right and has the mods you'd do anyway fine but don't overpay for it.

There isn't going to be another S1, ever. Audi confirmed some time ago it was too expensive to do and besides the new A1 is due to be discontinued in the near future so if you want an S1 then 2014-2018 is all you can choose from. As for values, for a long time no-one seemed to rate them, probably as they were very expensive compared with their rivals but it seems word has got around about how good they are. A heavily modified 2014 is not going to retain any more value than anything else IMO, what will retain value long term are near OEM or OEM+ examples.

Can't tell from that clipped picture what that's referring though given it's a service list then it probably is referring to the standard haldex oil change - BUT - again, the standard service procedure is NOT to remove the pump and clean the gauze. You need to find someone who will otherwise there isn't much point. Cost at a specialist should be around £130, which is what Audi charge for just the oil change anyway.

 

[yogiemoji]

The S1 is more fun than the S3. Outside of that it depends what you want from a car? I'd try and buy newer in both than 2014 though to be honest. Later S1's have more kit as standard and some parts revisions in the running gear that may save money in the longer term. Don't pay for the modifications, they don't increase the value - if the car is right and has the mods you'd do anyway fine but don't overpay for it.

There isn't going to be another S1, ever. Audi confirmed some time ago it was too expensive to do and besides the new A1 is due to be discontinued in the near future so if you want an S1 then 2014-2018 is all you can choose from. As for values, for a long time no-one seemed to rate them, probably as they were very expensive compared with their rivals but it seems word has got around about how good they are. A heavily modified 2014 is not going to retain any more value than anything else IMO, what will retain value long term are near OEM or OEM+ examples.

Can't tell from that clipped picture what that's referring though given it's a service list then it probably is referring to the standard haldex oil change - BUT - again, the standard service procedure is NOT to remove the pump and clean the gauze. You need to find someone who will otherwise there isn't much point. Cost at a specialist should be around £130, which is what Audi charge for just the oil change anyway.

Thank you for your reply Phazer!
Coming from a VW Golf, I really just want a car with a tad more power but same quality ride and interior.
Thinking in the long term, I'm leaning towards the s3 as it's bigger with more features.

Does the S3 also need the haldex pump and gauze, removed and cleaned respectively? Also, please may I ask what that service is called? Would it just be called haldex pump service?

 

[Phazer]

Thank you for your reply Phazer!
Coming from a VW Golf, I really just want a car with a tad more power but same quality ride and interior.
Thinking in the long term, I'm leaning towards the s3 as it's bigger with more features.

Does the S3 also need the haldex pump and gauze, removed and cleaned respectively? Also, please may I ask what that service is called? Would it just be called haldex pump service?

Yes, S3 is exactly the same in terms of Haldex, S1 & S3 are both Gen5 (albeit the S1 running different control software). Yes Haldex service is all you need but you will have to ask whoever it is if they remove the pump etc, if not go elsewhere.

 

[yogiemoji]

Yes, S3 is exactly the same in terms of Haldex, S1 & S3 are both Gen5 (albeit the S1 running different control software). Yes Haldex service is all you need but you will have to ask whoever it is if they remove the pump etc, if not go elsewhere.

All the Audis I've seen have only been serviced by Audi directly, from 2014 until ~2018-2020, so I don't think the proper Haldex service was done on any of them, I'll have to dig a little deeper to see if any of them did it. What happens if the Haldex service isn't done and only the oil changed? Do wear particles build up and cause seize of components etc?
(I think it's quite ridiculous for Audi to not include this in their service as it's so important)
(Btw, just went to see the s3, 72k miles on the clock. It drove really well, but they hid the fact that there were two deep key scratches that go through the paint on the passenger side, a massive dent on the inside left pillar (visible when you open the boot), and a few more on another panel, they refused to sort it out and it looks like the last major work on the car was back in 2020, there was an ECU dash failure and major coolant leaks...I've attached an image of some of the other (£500+) works done

... I'm going to give audi a call, if there's no history after 2020 I might give it a miss)

 

[Phazer]

If the car has a full service history and ticks all the other boxes for you then great. Buying through Audi gives you some warranty. Just make sure the AWD is actually working.

The gauze gets blocked with gunge/clutch material which makes the pump work far harder than it needs to ultimately causing the pump to fail. First you'll know is the car spins it's front wheels. It's not the end of the world but approx £250 for the part plus oil so a cost you don't want recurring.

At least that one has had the water pump/thermostat done. You should budget for it on any EA888 engined car you buy as it'll need doing at some point.

 

[yogiemoji]

If the car has a full service history and ticks all the other boxes for you then great. Buying through Audi gives you some warranty. Just make sure the AWD is actually working.

The gauze gets blocked with gunge/clutch material which makes the pump work far harder than it needs to ultimately causing the pump to fail. First you'll know is the car spins it's front wheels. It's not the end of the world but approx £250 for the part plus oil so a cost you don't want recurring.

At least that one has had the water pump/thermostat done. You should budget for it on any EA888 engined car you buy as it'll need doing at some point.

Thanks, Phazer!
It's not actually through Audi, it is through quite a big dealer though. From what we could tell there were no issues with the AWD as there was no wheel spin, we accelerated a decent amount and went faster than we normally would round a roundabout. However, in 4th gear when we accelerated the movement wasn't what was expected so the clutch might be worn. On the service document, is the water pump the "VALVE" item?

 

[Phazer]

No the valve is a heater control. The thermostat is listed at the top.

When you accelerated in 4th did the clutch actually slip? Revs rising with no acceleration?

 

[yogiemoji]

No the valve is a heater control. The thermostat is listed at the top.

When you accelerated in 4th did the clutch actually slip? Revs rising with no acceleration?

Yep the revs rose with no acceleration.

I decided to go with the 2014 S1, it did have the remap but, I fell in love with it as soon as I saw it! Also, good news it did have a haldex clean out recently, unlike all the other ones I had seen which had only been serviced by audi.

Thank you for all your help Phazer! You're a legend!

Kind regards,
Yogi

 

[Phazer]

Yep the revs rose with no acceleration.

I decided to go with the 2014 S1, it did have the remap but, I fell in love with it as soon as I saw it! Also, good news it did have a haldex clean out recently, unlike all the other ones I had seen which had only been serviced by audi.

Thank you for all your help Phazer! You're a legend!

Kind regards,
Yogi

You're welcome. Sounds good, bet you can't wait to get it!