Whats the best Tuning Module for my 2.5 TDi 180 ?

sc00byd00byd00

Frank and Beans...............
VCDS Map User
Have heard of loads of different types of tuning like Custom Code, Tunit, Upsolute, etc etc.


What are your experiences with any of the above and which would be the best to go for on my car ?
 
James swears by his 210hbp DPT, but thought £400 was a lot for a box in the post.

I think the best value option is £250 for the chip'n'spin rolling road session, with before and after dyno plots... with a range of remap options in the middle :D

They will do a range of 200bhp-240bhp for the manual TDI180, much more and it's new clutch time, even at 220bhp, you need to be fairly careful....
 

quattrojames

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
As Lostbok says I have a DPT tuning module giving an alleged 210hp. I fitted it within 100 miles of a replacement engine, but can confirm that it has given the car a lot more go, it has reduced, but not eliminated the torque flatspot these engines suffer with under 1800 rpm. The benefit of these modules are that they can be swapped from car to car, but obviously the disadvantage being they are just a generic map, and not tailored for each individual vehicle.

I was lucky with my module as I got it secondhand, and paid just over £100 which in my eyes is well worth it for the improved driveability alone, not to mention the extra 2-3 mpg. New they are £400, would I pay that? Not so sure. I think I would go for a cheaper, and vehicle specific remap.

In the diesel section FJTwelve has thoughts about a SW based RR day for 2.5 owners to compare tuning boxes/remaps etc, is that any use to you?
 
Don't put too much faith in the phrase "custom remaps"....

You'll see my rants about the AmD remaps that are around £400-£500 (as per my Golf)... essentially they "customise" it to the spec of the car by typing in the engine details, the mods that you have and then flashing the memory for that... and then sometimes not even bothering to dyno the car afterwards.... they were so arrogant about the fact that the remap "always works" that they tried to fob me off with somebody else's dyno chart and therefore they missed a fault that was robbing me of about 15-20bhp!

Chip'N'Spin's remap was the same flavour of static "custom" map, but at least (of you do it at a rolling road day), they dyno the car before and afterwards and will offer to change the map if you want to try for more power, etc or indeed roll it back.... especially important on 2.5TDI's since some maps will turn them into something akin to a battlefield smoke-flare... and I've seen a fair few remaps uncover faulty components (turbo's, sensors, fuel pressure regulators, injectors, etc), so the dyno run would be a GOOD idea...
 

Niknak

Registered User
Scooby - Awesome are having an open day soon so keep you eyes peeled, they used to offer a trial of a remap that lasts 24 hours so gives you chance to try before you buy.
 

fjtwelve

Moderator
Moderator
Agree with having a remap, and with before and after dyno test. If the before test shows you aren't making the power in standard trim theres not much point proceeding until you've cured that problem. Sure tuning boxes can be moved from car to car , but are you going to buy another identical car to replace this one?
Any reputable place should also run a diagnostic before the uprade to make sure everything is working properly - i would get one done independently if you aren't sure. I would also make sure all the mechanicals are also sorted before you start, essentially you want the car in A1 order before you start modifying it.
 

V6 Quatt

Registered User
Good point fjtwelve

Agree with having a remap, and with before and after dyno test. If the before test shows you aren't making the power in standard trim theres not much point proceeding until you've cured that problem. Sure tuning boxes can be moved from car to car , but are you going to buy another identical car to replace this one?
Any reputable place should also run a diagnostic before the uprade to make sure everything is working properly - i would get one done independently if you aren't sure. I would also make sure all the mechanicals are also sorted before you start, essentially you want the car in A1 order before you start modifying it.
 

sc00byd00byd00

Frank and Beans...............
VCDS Map User
I know a guy with a 2.5 who had it remapped but it was so problematic he eventually had it returned to normal.

So what do you suggest cos it looks like you have a remapped 2.5 ???
 

quattrojames

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Staff member
Moderator
So what do you suggest cos it looks like you have a remapped 2.5 ???

Yeah sorry I should have explained my post a bit better!

I am not for a minute suggesting you shouldn't do it, I do indeed have a tuning module fitted and my car performs faultlessly.

I was just reinforcing FJtwelves post, that if there are any issues with your current engine, which you may not even be aware of, then the remap will serve to highlight them.
 
Chip'N'Spin rolling road day, for £250 with befores and afters.... plus a variety of options.... you could even go for the "crazy race" map and if it's problematic you can always get it rolled back.... they keep your original map for a while after and at least with the RR, you know if it was on-spec before....
 

sc00byd00byd00

Frank and Beans...............
VCDS Map User
Chip'N'Spin rolling road day, for £250 with befores and afters.... plus a variety of options.... you could even go for the "crazy race" map and if it's problematic you can always get it rolled back.... they keep your original map for a while after and at least with the RR, you know if it was on-spec before....

So where is Chip'N'Spin and whens their next RR day ?
 
They're actually based in West London, but the Rolling Road days are at ChippedUK in Bromsgrove (SW of Brum).

I went to check the Chip'N'Spin thread in the main A-S forum, but seems that you got there before me!

There may well be better genuine custom maps out there, but most "custom" maps are the same as the Chip'N'Spin pre-programmed maps and any true customisation would be in the £500+ territory (some pre-defined maps cost this much £440 anyway!) and most other companies want your car for at least a full day!

In terms of choice of the best map to suit your requirements, plus the flexibility and transparency of what is being done on the day, I think the Chip'N'Spin approach is hard to beat, especially at their prices!
 

sc00byd00byd00

Frank and Beans...............
VCDS Map User

K7ERG

Registered User
I am looking at buying a 2.5TDI quattro 180. What about superchip?
Can the rest of the engine cope with the increase in torque? Rods etc. What power is the standard clutch rated to. Is there a stronger maybe (organic one available).???
 
Manual apparently a lot more capable than the auto.... From my limited experience of chatting to a few tuners, I believe the clutch is normally the first to go: with the rest of the components at standard, 220bhp (460Nm-ish) is the most that the majority of tuners recommend pushing the manual to and a bit above what's recommended for the auto. I think some people get uprated injectors, higher spec clutch and possibly turbo(?); resulting in 250bhp territory (???Nm)... but this is way out of my league - both in terms of what I'd want to spend and what I need.
 

K7ERG

Registered User
It would be a manual i was going for. Superchip quote 200bhp 448Nm.
I am guessing these engines are single turbo and not twin.??? What turbo(s) is used?

So the clutch is the weak point as said above. How about the internals?

Craig
 
not sure... given I was looking at low-end remapping / tweaks, jsut to bump up the mid-range toque and smooth out any flat-spots.... on the heavier remaps, the clutch was the main thing that was pointed out to me.

limitations are clutch and then injectors.... then turbo (I think!)...

single turbo, not sure on spec...
 
james - what went "pop" on your previous 2.5?
 

quattrojames

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
james - what went "pop" on your previous 2.5?

The idler pulley on the timing belt disintegrated. This "shouldn't" happen as long as they were replaced at the same time as the timing belt - unknown to me mine wasn't - prior to my ownership. This would no more affect a remapped car than a standard one so I wouldn't worry about it.

One weak point is the fuel injection pump - although whether this becomes "weaker" after a re-map I don't know.

@ K7ERG - what year is your 2.5? I am no expert but I think the early version of this engine had cam issues - try a PM to fjtwelve who has BTDT!
 

adamss24

Registered User
Guys, the "custom" remap is just a generic name of a map developed by some tunner wich bothered to spend a few weeks tweaking the engine. If you want a torquey motor, then a decent tuning box will do more than that as most remaps limit the torque at low revs. The clutch in the v6 tdi is strong enough to withstand abuse but the flywheel wont be pleased if you ride the clutch or do a few drag races. The 01E box fitted on these engines would be fine for much more than 250Bhp and the bottom end will easily take 500 Bhp before touching the internals. Most tuners will say the injector pump is the weak point in these, thats a load of bull as the same pump is used on big v6-v8 cummins and JCB/Mans tractors. I have tinkered with v6 tdi for a few years and they awesome engines. I would look for a Steinbauer, PSI Motorsport, Van Aaken, Dragon Motorsport tuning box as they really make the car shift. Soft cams were only replaced on cars with the "longlife" service intervals and rumours are that there were a batch of non-hardened cams wich were fitted after 1998 but i still believe is the oil kept for too long wich was to blame !
 

V6 Quatt

Registered User
Very true.

Had this conversation with my brother who is a franchise for Chips U.k

Had mine mapped today.

Awesome. If you are doing drag starts alot then clutch will suffer. Howewver, I went for a custom map on Economey which produced an extra 30 BHP and 60 NM of torque extra.:salute:

If intrested in getting yours done speak to Mark at Midland-Ferrari
on:
01562 743 137
www.midland-ferrari.co.uk

Guys, the "custom" remap is just a generic name of a map developed by some tunner wich bothered to spend a few weeks tweaking the engine. If you want a torquey motor, then a decent tuning box will do more than that as most remaps limit the torque at low revs. The clutch in the v6 tdi is strong enough to withstand abuse but the flywheel wont be pleased if you ride the clutch or do a few drag races. The 01E box fitted on these engines would be fine for much more than 250Bhp and the bottom end will easily take 500 Bhp before touching the internals. Most tuners will say the injector pump is the weak point in these, thats a load of bull as the same pump is used on big v6-v8 cummins and JCB/Mans tractors. I have tinkered with v6 tdi for a few years and they awesome engines. I would look for a Steinbauer, PSI Motorsport, Van Aaken, Dragon Motorsport tuning box as they really make the car shift. Soft cams were only replaced on cars with the "longlife" service intervals and rumours are that there were a batch of non-hardened cams wich were fitted after 1998 but i still believe is the oil kept for too long wich was to blame !
 
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funkyspider

Registered User
Surely a generic 'chip' is just swapping one safe generic factory map for a unpredicatable aftermarket one. It's matched to a perfectly running engine and takes no account of your individual engine, which may, for any number of reasons, be running less than optimal.

Being an ex subaru impreza owner I've encoutered countless owners who's car ran badly fuelled after plugin chip maps. I'd always go for a custom map preferably with an onroad session to tweak it. Rolling roads in my experience don't give the best all round results as they don't replicate on road driving conditions. A good mapper won't push any limit which will decrease the reliability of engine/clutch/gearbox, a plugin chip doesnt care. I also believe that with diesel mapping you need careful tweaking for anti-knock and smoke reduction, but I haven't much experience with diesel mapping.
 
funky - the Chip'N'Spin rolling road days are a pre-dynorun, remap, post-dynorun and then you get to take the car for a drive before you decide if you want to keep it...
 
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