What I have been up to the past year...(picture heavy)
- Thread starter Andy123
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You want to put your foot down more for the logs, its taken you 8 seconds to get from 2.5k to 5.5k ??
Ive got some 10mm stainless pipe that will bend easily if you are still having heat issues....
Ive got some 10mm stainless pipe that will bend easily if you are still having heat issues....
Cheers sandip- the values looks pretty similar.
My foot is planted on the floor Dave! Logged in 3rd gear. I've sorted out the issue with the brake servo thanks, bent some 10mm ali tube myself and modded the original fitting a bit so hopefully I won't have any issues with that now.
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A couple more logs today. I turned the boost up a few more clicks on the mbc. Had a play about with the dump valve spring but still don't seem to have that sorted out, I'm trying out different springs but can't seem to get a suitable setting. The peak boost this time on the log was about 20psi. I logged the boost also on the Zeitronix unit I have and saw 21.6 peak. Top airflow I got was in the second log at 228. Still seems really hesitant/strange under 3k revs but past that and when the turbo kicks in it drives nicely so I need to figure out what the issue is. Any comments again appreciated.
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Off topic but Can't believe iv only just seen this. That looks amazing dude nice colour choice.
Bet you'v never been told " I like Yr rear end" as much in Yr life
Thanks for the comments damo. It is a bit disturbing so many guys saying they like my rear end!!
Ok so today I went about looking for a few leaks again as I knew there was one somewhere underneath the SEM as I could feel it at idle. I was hoping by now to have had my replacement intake but I still haven't got this. Anyway, I took off the SEM so I could inspect it again from underneath and when I took it off I got a bit of a surprise when I looked inside the intake ports. They all seemed to have a residue of oil inside them, some more than others and the base of the valve guides looked pretty dirty with oil. The oil breather is going direct to the catch tank so oil isn't going in that way so it appears as though it is coming past the guides. The head was totally rebuilt with new guides too! Below is a few pictures, the quality isn't great but it was the best I could get.
Anyone think it is worth going back to the place that built the head up as surely it is an issue with what they did if there is oil leaking past the guide/seals? Could help explain the occasional smoke I have at start up from the exhaust as I ruled out any coolant leak into the cylinders. The old amk head (below) I took off didn't have any oil residue inside the intake ports and that had done 70k miles.
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It may be worth sending them the picture?, i would be very upset if they are leaking, you cant get a decent job done these days....tell tale for them seals are very smokey exhaust from cold/overnight, then left on idle when hot they smoke..
maybe the cause of your running issues?
maybe the cause of your running issues?
I'm going to go and see them tomorrow with the pictures. I am pretty fed up with these things to be honest. All the hassle I have had with this build and the issues since getting it running have come from work done by other people. I hate having to wait on other people and get them to do some work but sometimes you just don't have the tools to do the job. I expect it is an issue with the seals as it would explain the smoke at start up and would also be fouling the plugs causing some of the hesitation I have had lower down. It certainly wouldn't help it either way. I was just checking the invoice for the head work and everything was overhauled- new intake/exhaust guides, seals, etc etc. Like you said Dave, it seems to be hit and miss getting a decent job done unless you do it yourself and know it has been done correctly. All because I couldn't find a suitable valve compressor to do the job with myself. Even if they agreed to doing the work again for free then it's still having to buy new head bolts, belts etc and the time for me to take the head out and put it back in that doesn't get factored in.
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True the rework to get it built back up will no doubt be seen as shrugged shoulders...
did you notice your oil consumption? as if a lot as been getting past it will have killed the octane in your fuel..
did you notice your oil consumption? as if a lot as been getting past it will have killed the octane in your fuel..
I don't think much oil has been lost, I have checked the level a couple of times and it has seemed ok but then even just a small amount leaking through on the inlets and fouling the petrol will cause issues. It must have been a reasonable amount anyway for the walls to be fouled with oil and the base of the guides looking oily given that it has only seen 100 miles or so on the road since the rebuild. I will see what they say tomorrow and go from there.
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Wow only 100 mile...very odd to be all leaking, unless they have used micky mouse gear......Good luck Andy..
I went to see the company that built the head. They want to see the head to inspect it. They tired to um and ahh that it could be something else and that it had never occured before, even asked me if I had rebuilt the bottom end etc etc seeming to try and think of a reason why what I had done could have caused it. Anyway, head needed to come off. I wasn't 100% sure if I could get the head off without taking the engine out but thought I'd try and managed to just about. Now I have a decapitated engine:
I'll strip the rest of the head and then go back tomorrow with the head itself and they will inspect it while I am there and hopefully agree to sorting it out as there has been a mistake with what they have done and also agree to some sort of compensation for the cost of the parts I have to replace.
I'll strip the rest of the head and then go back tomorrow with the head itself and they will inspect it while I am there and hopefully agree to sorting it out as there has been a mistake with what they have done and also agree to some sort of compensation for the cost of the parts I have to replace.
Sam_
Down under
That's a real shame it had to be split open again. Was there any play of the valve in the guide?
Also, did you change breather setup by any chance?
Also, did you change breather setup by any chance?
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I'd probably use a different word myself than shame Sam. It isn't just one intake port that had oil residue inside, it was most of them. There doesn't appear to be any play although I haven't inspected it much myself, just finished taking the head off before. All the tappets, cams etc were perfectly fine.
The pcv is directed to the catch tank so the oil isn't going in through the intake. The intake was clean as a whistle, all of the turbo, throttle body etc so the oil is definately coming down past the guides. It would also explain the smoke I tend to get at cold start and idle and also possibly another reason for it seemingly running badly in the first few thousand revs when moving off from a standstill etc.
I just hope they accept there is a fault with what was done or the guides they put in and get it sorted and agree to pay for the replacement parts. I can't be bothered with an argument and trying to pass the blame. At the end of the day, if it is their fault and they agree to it, I could easily demand compensation for the time to take the head off and put it all back together which we all know isn't cheap.
Sam_
Down under
Like you say, hopefully they are good about it and offer to sort it out properly and do what is right (recoup at least some of your costs!).
I hope it all pans out.
I hope it all pans out.
I took the head in to where it was built and we took it apart and inspected what was done. Oil was definately getting past some of the guides, most notably port 1 and 4 and also only past valves 1 and 3 in each port. Valve 2 in each port was fine so that was strange. Tolerance of the guides were much tighter than the original audi spec so they weren't an issue, the stem seals also were tight and you couldn't pass the valve past it without pushing it. We therefore came to a bit of a dead end. The only explanation we could come up with was that the oil was passing the outside of the guide as if previously the head had had a repair done to the original guides. I'm unsure whether the original head had, the person it was bought off said it hadn't had any damage, was off a 70k engine and when it was inspected it didn't suggest otherwise but you never know 100%. The guy is now testing the head with a dye to see if he can see if anything is passing the guides and then we will go from there. Could end up having to replace the head. I'm happy that they haven't done anything which would have caused it now so it looks like I am going to be out of pocket even more than I had planned. It looks as though the issue was with the original head.
Anyone know of anywhere which stocks new or refubished heads? I need a large port but may look at a small port and port it out if I can't get hold of a decent large port head. I don't want to go down this road again and it looks like it might be a new head required.
Anyone know of anywhere which stocks new or refubished heads? I need a large port but may look at a small port and port it out if I can't get hold of a decent large port head. I don't want to go down this road again and it looks like it might be a new head required.
Bit of an update on the thread. I was having issues with the car being very erratic low in the rev range and low on power, basically off boost it drove like sh*t. For some of you that may not know, I had a Unitronics 630cc (turns out it kind of wasn't) big turbo file flashed onto the ecu for the spec I had supplied them with. They have a pretty good rep in Canada and the US. Anyway, I was pretty confident that the issues weren't coming from anything I had built or done to the car myself although you always doubt yourself in these instances. For the past month, I have had a constant back and forth email exchange with Unitronics to try figure out the issue..........log this, log that, log without this connected, log it again, jog on the spot etc etc. Nothing was really achieved apart from wasting my time. They told me that the afr, timing etc all looked good which is what it appeared to however I hadn't been asked to check the fuel trims. I had had enough by this point so arranged to take the car over to Bill's today to get him to log it and see what was up with it. A quick check of the fuel trim showed a max of 25% and the below log shows what the trim was on one of the runs. Normally this would throw up a CEL code (it was thinking that it was running lean so keeping the injectors open longer) but conveniently this appeared to have been mapped out so that the ecu was blind to the fact that the fuelling was all over the place. Normal readings should be around or below the 5% mark i think. We managed to read the map that Unitronic did (normally it is protected but i guess the person who did it thought why waste extra time) but it didn't really give any indication as to what the maps were referring to but you could see the difference between stock and their map. Quite a few parts just seemed to add 20% here or there to the stock map, there were also quite a few points which showed a constant figure e.g. 0 which were hiding information from the ecu to not throw up any fault codes, strangely there were also three files for three different rev limitations. The rev limiter should have been set for about 8000rpm, the three files we saw were 6800rpm (which was what it was using) 7100 and 7500 i think- they couldn't even seem to get this right. Lo and behold the rev limiter kicked in on the first run at 6800rpm and that was that.
After a few more logs we then decided to flash a new map by Bill to see how that performed. Fuel trims returned to normal, the car seemed smoother and it could rev past 6800rpm. The peak boost we saw was about 24psi settling to about 22psi, producing 375bhp and 298 torque. EGT's were also pretty good at a max of about 850ish I think. There wasn't any water injection hooked up at this point and unfortunately the aquamist I had wasn't playing game - dodgy fuse or something but it was an **** to get to the wiring so I decided to have a look at that myself later and get that mapped in with some fine tuning further down the line. There is room for some more boost though and factoring in the water injection should see a safe and reliable figure without risking too much timing pull.
I've uploaded the few video's I took- might need to add another silencer to the exhaust as it is partial to making a bit of noise. The drive back was far better that the drive there and apart from a dodgy clutch switch causing it to rev quite dramatically between gear changes, it drove like I expected in the first place and was nice to not drive something that felt like a pogo stick with a turbo, constantly bouncing about.
Thanks to Bill for his expertise and tea and also to Mark who also helped out. (If you have a minute Bill, could you upload the power graphs please) Was good to finally get to the bottom of the issue and discuss all things car related. I'll be back in the new year with a bit of water injection and some more boost. Meanwhile I'm going to get on to Unitronics and see if I can get some money back....................
Log showing the fuel trims with the Unitronics file and then the other map.
Couple of video's:
After a few more logs we then decided to flash a new map by Bill to see how that performed. Fuel trims returned to normal, the car seemed smoother and it could rev past 6800rpm. The peak boost we saw was about 24psi settling to about 22psi, producing 375bhp and 298 torque. EGT's were also pretty good at a max of about 850ish I think. There wasn't any water injection hooked up at this point and unfortunately the aquamist I had wasn't playing game - dodgy fuse or something but it was an **** to get to the wiring so I decided to have a look at that myself later and get that mapped in with some fine tuning further down the line. There is room for some more boost though and factoring in the water injection should see a safe and reliable figure without risking too much timing pull.
I've uploaded the few video's I took- might need to add another silencer to the exhaust as it is partial to making a bit of noise. The drive back was far better that the drive there and apart from a dodgy clutch switch causing it to rev quite dramatically between gear changes, it drove like I expected in the first place and was nice to not drive something that felt like a pogo stick with a turbo, constantly bouncing about.
Thanks to Bill for his expertise and tea and also to Mark who also helped out. (If you have a minute Bill, could you upload the power graphs please) Was good to finally get to the bottom of the issue and discuss all things car related. I'll be back in the new year with a bit of water injection and some more boost. Meanwhile I'm going to get on to Unitronics and see if I can get some money back....................
Log showing the fuel trims with the Unitronics file and then the other map.
Couple of video's:
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Dane
Had an 8L S3, a B5 RS4 now I have a B8 S4
why can I only press like once! that sounds amazing
Id have totally been there if I'd have known. glad it feels better mate.
Id have totally been there if I'd have known. glad it feels better mate.
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Sounds really nice. It's so much easier to deal with someone in the uk then to be sending emails back and forth to canada. Bill is over 2 hours away from me but I'd rather go to see him then anyone else.
Thanks Dane- I should have maybe posted that I was going, didn't think anybody would be interested. I've got to go back to tweak a few bits so will let you know when I next go. I'm debating whether to add another silencer to the exhaust to cut a bit of the drone whilst cruising- either that or I'll just keep some nurofen in the glovebox.
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I know mate, hindsight I wish I hadn't gone down that route as I'm about the same distance as you are from Bill's and it would have been far simpler and less of a ballache than it has turned out to be.
Thanks Andy. I can get it out of the garage now and finally start to drive it properly!
How laggy does the GT30 feel Andy? Has all the other mods (SEM, large port head, etc..) made a big improvement?
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Some nice curves there.
I'm guessing this turbo comes in with a bit of a bang with the slight torque and boost spike?
I'm guessing this turbo comes in with a bit of a bang with the slight torque and boost spike?
Thanks for the plots Bill.
Andyc- it doesn't feel that laggy, it wakes up about 3.5k and starts to pull nicely at this point. I can't compare the mods side by side with anything else because this is the first power run I have done and I haven't added bits here and there to see the improvement. It does seem to want to keep going though so we will see what more can come from it. There are a few differences with some of the other builds with gt30 most notably most of them are using log exhaust manifolds whereas mine is tubular- this could explain why my EGT readings seem to be fairly good even though the sensor is in the collector just before the opening to the turbine on the turbo which would be hotter than placing it in the downpipe post turbo. The gt30's I have seen seem to have produced a similar amount of power though with slight variations in the way they boost,torque curves etc just based on the different setup's. Tuffty's will be interesting to watch as he has a larger turbine wheel and the housing he will be using will be bigger than a t25 and is external gate so should flow better and should bump up the power.
Pat- thanks for the comments.
Westy- yeah when it kicks in it does come in with a bit of a bang. It is pretty smooth delivery wise but at 4-4.5k it is on it hard and that's when things get fun.
Andyc- it doesn't feel that laggy, it wakes up about 3.5k and starts to pull nicely at this point. I can't compare the mods side by side with anything else because this is the first power run I have done and I haven't added bits here and there to see the improvement. It does seem to want to keep going though so we will see what more can come from it. There are a few differences with some of the other builds with gt30 most notably most of them are using log exhaust manifolds whereas mine is tubular- this could explain why my EGT readings seem to be fairly good even though the sensor is in the collector just before the opening to the turbine on the turbo which would be hotter than placing it in the downpipe post turbo. The gt30's I have seen seem to have produced a similar amount of power though with slight variations in the way they boost,torque curves etc just based on the different setup's. Tuffty's will be interesting to watch as he has a larger turbine wheel and the housing he will be using will be bigger than a t25 and is external gate so should flow better and should bump up the power.
Pat- thanks for the comments.
Westy- yeah when it kicks in it does come in with a bit of a bang. It is pretty smooth delivery wise but at 4-4.5k it is on it hard and that's when things get fun.
Thanks Mush! Should hopefully be able to get towards 400 with some water injection and some more boost. Are you nearly finished yet with your build? I'm looking forward to seeing your results and the difference that extra capacity makes. How's the inlet manifold coming along?
Its coming On well bud, goes for its MOT on wednesday, and then i can get some miles on it. Its only got a paltry 5 miles on it at the minute
Ive put some thought into the manifold but itll not be getting done till after christmas. Cant wait to get that sorted as i should be putting miles on whilst i make it so it should be a bolt on ready for mapping job. Not that it ever goes that smoothly ..
Ive put some thought into the manifold but itll not be getting done till after christmas. Cant wait to get that sorted as i should be putting miles on whilst i make it so it should be a bolt on ready for mapping job. Not that it ever goes that smoothly ..
