Clutch advice please!

[Audi-partner]

Need some advice please on clutch options.

I've just recently got my 2.0tdi 120ps remapped and almost inevetibly, the clutch is slipping from 4th at around 2500rpm.

I can't remember the exact figures after my remap (I've messaged the company) but I'm sure that he said it was now 188bhp and possibly that he added 60lb/ft of torque which would now mean I've around 275lb/ft

If that's the case, can anyone advise on clutch and flywheel options please? I've read lots that there are 2 main brands (Sachs and LUK) but which to go for that will happily accomadate the extra torque?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Audi-partner]

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[desertstorm]

How many miles has the car done ?
The original clutch will be a Sach or LUK item.
You can get a standard LUK clutch and DMF to replace yours for quite reasonable prices, This is Darkside who aren't the cheapest but you get an idea. You have to add VAT and shipping on top of these prices.
http://www.darksidedevelopments.co....h-kit-for-2-0-tdi-audi-a4-a5-b8-platform.html

The one to go for if you are planning any more upgrades or just want Bullet proof going forward is a Sachs Organic. Again you could probably get this cheaper shopping around.
http://www.darksidedevelopments.co....h-kit-for-2-0-tdi-audi-a4-a5-b8-platform.html

If buying a standard clutch I think I would be more inclined to go LUK, although theres not a lot in it.

Buypartsby are pretty good for LUK clutches and is where I would probably go if buying a standard LUK clutch for mine.
Karl

 

[Audi-partner]

How many miles has the car done ?
The original clutch will be a Sach or LUK item.
You can get a standard LUK clutch and DMF to replace yours for quite reasonable prices, This is Darkside who aren't the cheapest but you get an idea. You have to add VAT and shipping on top of these prices.
http://www.darksidedevelopments.co....h-kit-for-2-0-tdi-audi-a4-a5-b8-platform.html

The one to go for if you are planning any more upgrades or just want Bullet proof going forward is a Sachs Organic. Again you could probably get this cheaper shopping around.
http://www.darksidedevelopments.co....h-kit-for-2-0-tdi-audi-a4-a5-b8-platform.html

If buying a standard clutch I think I would be more inclined to go LUK, although theres not a lot in it.

Buypartsby are pretty good for LUK clutches and is where I would probably go if buying a standard LUK clutch for mine.
Karl

OK mate thanks for that. I'm not planning on doing anything else to increase bhp or torque, so guess I should be OK with just standard.

I've been quoted a very reasonable £700 for parts and labour, and the clutch and flywheel will be either Sachs or LUK, dependent on what's available when the mechanic orders.

I'm just concerned that my clutch will still slip on a standard clutch.

I'll have a look at the links you've provided.

Cheers

 

[desertstorm]

I would have thought the standard clutch would be fine at that level of torque, unless it's got some miles on it. You could always ask them to reduce the torque a little around 2-2.5 K RPM, It would still have the same power at the top end and when you accelerating through the gears you won't be going below 2.5K so it won't be any slower.
If the map has a torque spike then that could be whats causing the issue.

 

[Audi-partner]

I would have thought the standard clutch would be fine at that level of torque, unless it's got some miles on it. You could always ask them to reduce the torque a little around 2-2.5 K RPM, It would still have the same power at the top end and when you accelerating through the gears you won't be going below 2.5K so it won't be any slower.
If the map has a torque spike then that could be whats causing the issue.

Got the dyno figures emailed over from the tuner, it's 320lb/ft and 188bhp. Am I right in thinking the car won't reach those figures on an actual road, just on the RR?

I'm definitely going with a standard clutch after looking around at prices for uprated, as I can't justify the cost versus a £200 remap.

I guess once the new clutch is in I'll just have to hope for the best and if there is slippage, get the tuner to tame it down a little? Either way, thanks for your input.

 

[desertstorm]

The car will hit those figures on a normal road. More so in higher gears is where you would get the issue.
It's not the 188bhp thats causing the problem but the 320Lb/ ft of torque and probably the torque spike associated with it.
If you have a look at this dyno run for a 2.0 TDI 140 BHP B8 off the Darkside site you can see the torque spikes that would be causing the clutch to potentially slip.

because it's a small turbo the boost builds really rapidly hence the almost vertical increase in torque at around 2K RPM, the boost overshoots has to be reined in and then gets to go again causing the second spike before it settles down.
This gives you what is a strong shove when the turbo spools but the clutch can't cope with this much torque increase.
By tweaking the boost and fuelling a little you end up with a less aggressive more clutch friendly and driveable car. Those boost spikes also translate into wheel spin / loss of traction as the tyres have the same issue trying to transfer the power to the road when there is a sudden increase in torque delivery from the engine.

 

[Audi-partner]

The car will hit those figures on a normal road. More so in higher gears is where you would get the issue.
It's not the 188bhp thats causing the problem but the 320Lb/ ft of torque and probably the torque spike associated with it.
If you have a look at this dyno run for a 2.0 TDI 140 BHP B8 off the Darkside site you can see the torque spikes that would be causing the clutch to potentially slip.

because it's a small turbo the boost builds really rapidly hence the almost vertical increase in torque at around 2K RPM, the boost overshoots has to be reined in and then gets to go again causing the second spike before it settles down.
This gives you what is a strong shove when the turbo spools but the clutch can't cope with this much torque increase.
By tweaking the boost and fuelling a little you end up with a less aggressive more clutch friendly and driveable car. Those boost spikes also translate into wheel spin / loss of traction as the tyres have the same issue trying to transfer the power to the road when there is a sudden increase in torque delivery from the engine.

This one's mine. As you can tell I'm no expert, but mine looks a lot smoother than that? When I don't plant my foot, it doesn't slip, that might sound obvious? When I accelerate smoothly it feels incredible. Guess I'll just have to take it easy with the new clutch and possibly get them to tone it down a bit.

 

[desertstorm]

That looks a lot better than the Darkside plot, certainly a lot more like what I would like to see.
It's a great difference compared to the standard car, just about a 45% increase in power and torque.
How many miles has the car done ?. If it's over 100K then old clutch will be a little weak, however if you have only 50-60K on the car even a new clutch will probably start struggling after a while going by what it's doing now.

 

[Audi-partner]

Yea

That looks a lot better than the Darkside plot, certainly a lot more like what I would like to see.
It's a great difference compared to the standard car, just about a 45% increase in power and torque.
How many miles has the car done ?. If it's over 100K then old clutch will be a little weak, however if you have only 50-60K on the car even a new clutch will probably start struggling after a while going by what it's doing now.

Car has 57K on what I believe is it's original clutch. It's booked in for next week for a new one, so here's hoping.

If it starts slipping again in the future, I can just blame the wife and talk her into getting an updated one instead haha.

 

[desertstorm]

If you are considering keeping the car for a few years I would probably take it back to Big Fish and ask them to tweak the torque down a little. You wont miss 30Nm off the peak torque . The car will still make the same top power and do everything the same over 2500 RPM as it does now but the clutch will thank you.

 

[Audi-partner]

If you are considering keeping the car for a few years I would probably take it back to Big Fish and ask them to tweak the torque down a little. You wont miss 30Nm off the peak torque . The car will still make the same top power and do everything the same over 2500 RPM as it does now but the clutch will thank you.

OK mate, thanks for that. I think I will. I suppose at the end of the day anything is an improvement on the standard performance.

You've been a big help.
Cheers!