Noob Stop/Start question...

[Jemster]

There's one particular aspect of Stop/Start that is bugging me and I wonder if it's just my car or if anyone can shed any light on the whys and wherefores?

First off, I've a '15 TDI Quattro S-tronic in case it makes a difference, maybe the rules change for manual cars.

If I come to a stop on the foot brake and the car's happy, it'll stop the engine. If I then engage the parking brake... it restarts the engine. The only time it seems to actively stop is when I am blinding the person behind with my foot brake lights on.

Is this correct? I can't understand why it doesn't stay stopped when I put the handbrake on. Seems to be illogical, but maybe there's a good reason?

 

[A4B82.0tfsi-12]

There are a couple of things, like 37 of them, that need to be verified, for the stop/start to come on and stay on. Read the manual found in the glowe compartment for info on the several points that are needed for the function.

 

[Booboo]

Mine is an auto 2.0 TSFi 2014 & mine is the same.

 

[Jemster]

There are a couple of things, like 37 of them, that need to be verified, for the stop/start to come on and stay on. Read the manual found in the glowe compartment for info on the several points that are needed for the function.

I think I know 36 of them and understand the reasons (lighting, rear window demister, anything that draws power, ac, etc..) I just don’t understand the parking brake cancelling stop/start. Any manual stop/start I’ve driven has left the engine off when the handbrake is engaged. The manual specifically says if I take my foot off the foot brake it will restart.

After years of driving ‘considerately’ and not dazzling those behind with brake lights for longer than necessary, not to mention trying to avoid holding hot pads to a brake disc, it doesn’t seem a good idea to encourage these bad habits back again.

 

[scotty76]

This is the way mine behaves too. It only shuts off if you put it in N or P neither of which I do when at the traffic lights.

 

[scotty76]

I think part of it is in the manual version it gets a hint you're about to set off when you press the clutch so can restart the car. There's no such cue in the auto version and it doesn't seem to involve the throttle in the decision. I agree it's a bit daft though.

 

[arad85]

It's the way the system is designed to work. The newer versions (as fitted to the B9's and my old but new A3) restart the engine on throttle depression.

 

[Jemster]

I think part of it is in the manual version it gets a hint you're about to set off when you press the clutch so can restart the car. There's no such cue in the auto version and it doesn't seem to involve the throttle in the decision. I agree it's a bit daft though.

But there is a cue... isn’t the parking brake already locked - you have to have your foot on the brake pedal, or alternatively be applying the throttle? Surely those cues could have been used to restart.

Oh well, at least it’s not anything up with my car, just seems wholly pointless to have a stop/start system to cut down on emissions in traffic jams when bad traffic would have you using the handbrake often. Glad to hear they’re sorting it out on the B9.

It also keeps catching me out when parallel parking. Pull up beside the space and switch from drive to reverse and half the time the engine stops and restarts. Must be a way to modulate this on the throttle somehow to prevent this but I haven’t found it yet.

 

[scotty76]

It also keeps catching me out when parallel parking. Pull up beside the space and switch from drive to reverse and half the time the engine stops and restarts. Must be a way to modulate this on the throttle somehow to prevent this but I haven’t found it yet.

Gentle braking is the key to it. My car has hill hold assist (HHA). If you brake to a gentle stop the brakes will engage without the engine stopping. If you brake more forcefully the engine shuts off.

 

[Jemster]

Gentle braking is the key to it. My car has hill hold assist (HHA). If you brake to a gentle stop the brakes will engage without the engine stopping. If you brake more forcefully the engine shuts off.

I'll have to try this. I don't have HHA though. In this scenario it's probably not what you want. If you're on a busy street and trying to get parked quickly, you may not be the most gentle coming to a rest and then you go for reverse and have a planet-saving quick stop/start precisely when you want to swing it into the space.

All seems to smack of a half-baked idea really. Heart is in the right place, sorely let down by the implementation. Has Carista the ability to memorize the last stop/start state? I haven't activated my free trial of it yet as I want to make sure I get everything covered in a month that I need done.

 

[scotty76]

All seems to smack of a half-baked idea really. Heart is in the right place, sorely let down by the implementation. Has Carista the ability to memorize the last stop/start state? I haven't activated my free trial of it yet as I want to make sure I get everything covered in a month that I need done.

Yes it does or you can disable it completely.

https://caristaapp.com/vehicles/audi/a4/b8

 

[Booboo]

I've noticed if I brake gentle the engine won't shutdown sometimes at the junction. If I press the pedal harder while standing still the engine will shut off.

 

[jetty]

Just turn the stupid thing off. I'm the same as the OP - use the hill hold option, foot off brake, no more dazzle at lights.
I also find when braking gently the engine will cut off whilst still coasting up to a junction/lights etc - steering goes heavy and I have to lift off brake pedal to restart.
Wish there was a way to permanently disable the "feature" without having to press the button every time the ignition is switched off.

 

[Jemster]

Just turn the stupid thing off. I'm the same as the OP - use the hill hold option, foot off brake, no more dazzle at lights.
I also find when braking gently the engine will cut off whilst still coasting up to a junction/lights etc - steering goes heavy and I have to lift off brake pedal to restart.
Wish there was a way to permanently disable the "feature" without having to press the button every time the ignition is switched off.

Yeah I've had the heavy steering too, with that momentary unwanted cut out switching from Drive to Reverse.

So if I had Hill Hold, on an auto, if I stop and hill hold cuts in, the engine stops. if I then release the foot brake, the engine remains off? Is that right? It doesn't restart as soon as you lift your foot off the brake pedal?

Perhaps if there was a level you could hold the brake pedal at where the lights would go out but the engine would remain off, then it'd be ok. Or alternatively if the brake lights had a timer that made them cut out after, say, 10s if still stationary... wouldn't solve the heat dissipation problem but at least would stop dazzling people.

Ahhh so many possibilities, and yet none of them implemented. Audi should be paying us to design their new cars.

Looks like I'll get the memory button option turned on. Problem solved.

 

[Dippy]

I think I understand the rationale. The purpose of stop/start is to improve economy & reduce emissions. However the Audi engineers have tried to make sure that it is not an inconvenience. Although they seem to have failed (although I like it), they gave it their best shot. So in the case where you have your foot on the brake, you clearly are not going to accelerate at the same time (?), so its 'convenient' to stop the engine. When you release the foot brake, it assumes that you want to go so it starts the engine. In my car it always starts quickly so personally I am not inconvenienced.

Now if I understand the OP correctly, the concern is why it should start when the automatic brake is applied, with the gearbox in D or S, and the foot brake released. Well this is effectively the same as HHA. It is correct to assume that the drive will want to move at any point by pressing the accelerator which is why the engine restarts. The alternative to keep it stopped is to change the gear selector as @scotty76 noted.

The alternative, as seems to be the case for the B9 as @arad85 noted, is to start on accelerator. Personally I would not like that because it introduces a delay. With the turbo lag and the slush box, I'd rather not have yet another delay in getting a B9 S-car off the line.

 

[Jemster]

You're right. I just find the logic very strange. Like, if I come to a stop in traffic, the engine stops. No problem with that. But if I then find my stop is going to be longer than a few seconds, I'll engage the parking brake and release the foot brake. This doesn't mean I want to pull away, so the engine should not fire up at this stage, but it does.

I'll try getting used to kicking it into Neutral and then applying the parking brake, maybe just a new habit I need to get programmed in to my head.

 

[Dippy]

I do know what you mean. But your desire to save the driver behind from having to see your bright stop lights is probably a rare thing. I wish we were all more considerate to each other on the road.

 

[scotty76]

I do know what you mean. But your desire to save the driver behind from having to see your bright stop lights is probably a rare thing. I wish we were all more considerate to each other on the road.

This unfortunately. I used to be considerate and apply the handbrake but then noticed I was in about the 1% bracket of people that do. So if I want the engine stopped I keep my foot on the brake.

 

[Jemster]

Hahaha I'm transformed from being a polite BMW driver who actually knew how to use indicators to an Audi driver who blinds people overnight!

Wonder if I can disable my indicators with Carista....

 

[jdp1962]

Stop/start is the work of the devil. The second happiest day of my S4-owning life (the first being the day I got it) was the day Carista allowed me to switch the default setting to OFF.

 

[Neilmack59]

I have same spec as you Jester and was similarly confused, also had the desire to not dazzle person behind me at lights. I have learned to put the selector to park if I am sure I am stopping for more than a short time at night, parking break on. Restart works fine then, foot on brake, back to drive, gas, go.

Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk

 

[666markyboy]

Altered mine with VCDS so it's default position is off as I find it very annoying and have you seen the price of a new starter motor ?

 

[Jemster]

But... but... the starter motor is up-rated to deal with Start / Stop

I cannot believe that it's good for the engine or battery though. That startup shudder has got to put more wear on components than letting it idle smoothly. It's a bit like the Roads Service telling us ramps don't do any harm to our suspension, even though when you speak to garage owners they'll tell you they now change an awful lot more shocks / springs / bushes than they ever had to in the past.

The car's in with Audi today for the headlamp washer cover, when I get it back I'll get my Carista trial period kicked off and get it coded for memory, then I can go through an environmentally conscious period of my life every few months...

 

[jdp1962]

But... but... the starter motor is up-rated to deal with Start / Stop

Bet you still believe in Santa Claus...

 

[Dippy]

Stop/start is the work of the devil. The second happiest day of my S4-owning life (the first being the day I got it) was the day Carista allowed me to switch the default setting to OFF.

Bet you still believe in Santa Claus...

Go and kick a dog - it might cheer you up!

Hahaha I'm transformed from being a polite BMW driver who actually knew how to use indicators to an Audi driver who blinds people overnight!

Having ACC makes me a better Audi driver. With the usual madness on our motorways I just let the car keep its own safe distance. I look ahead and see cars driving at XXmph so close to the one in front, and I think "I used to drive like that..."

 

[jdp1962]

Having ACC makes me a better Audi driver. With the usual madness on our motorways I just let the car keep its own safe distance. I look ahead and see cars driving at XXmph so close to the one in front, and I think "I used to drive like that..."

Any idea if ACC something that can be coded in if you already have regular CC and front parking sensors, or does it need extra hardware?

 

[Bristle Hound]

Yes it does or you can disable it completely.

https://caristaapp.com/vehicles/audi/a4/b8

Personally, I hate stop/start with a passion
The best thing I ever did was the mod with the Carista app that @scotty76 mentions above

 

[arad85]

Any idea if ACC something that can be coded in if you already have regular CC and front parking sensors, or does it need extra hardware?

Extra hardware. The only thing I wish my car had (had it on my A3 and loved it).

 

[Bristle Hound]

@jdp1962 - The ACC works from a separate radar sensor Jeff, not the front parking sensors
https://www.audi-technology-portal....adaptive-cruise-control-with-stop-go-function

 

[Dippy]

Yes, there is a sensor at the front on the offside, just to the right of the fog light as you look at it. The B9 has two of these so I assume that the system is better, although mine works fine so I'm not sure what benefit having two sensors gives the B9 cars.