4 hours to change springs on an S3?
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Remove rear shocks, swap springs & refix everything, then remove both front hubs, remove springs, swap over, refix it all, alignment aswell which takes 30 mins+, 2hrs would be seriously pushing it & I've done a few now & my SB to do shortly, I'd say 3-4 as you have to allow for test drives aswell, remember time is money, if they're using there time to test the work they've done for you then they of course are within there rights to charge, its not an unfair amount of time mate, at least they're realistic, some say 2 hrs so you prepare for that cost, then its 4, so I'd prefer upfront to know the max, wouldnt you.
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My mate and I did mine and his in around 1.5 hours each and that was without a four post lift!
If they include allignment then maybe just over 2 hours - that is if they are working flat out but I doubt that very much!
If they include allignment then maybe just over 2 hours - that is if they are working flat out but I doubt that very much!
rickyquicky
Registered User
So there were 2 of you doing the job, time charged by mechanics is based on a single person doing the job in 99.999% of cases, so if they use 2 mechanics then its twice the cost, hence 1 person 4 hours max, but you have to also allow for unforeseen, like bolts rusted on, etc etc as I had when doing some work for Jordan & his A3, took us hours upon hours to get some bolts undone, these things are unaware when taking a job on, 3-4 hours is fair.
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Of course you will need allignment! You have remove shocks and springs from the car which will be in slightly different positions to where they were prior to removal. Plus, the chances of the car having had allignment done previously is slim. Also, for peace of mind it would be most beneficial to have the allignement done after spring change!
Not being funny, but are you even lucid????
Most work on suspension should have an alignment done as things do get knocked out, if anything as a precaution.
What you mean what are they testing for, just to make sure it feels ok as a recent member namely Jordan again had a ***** experience with someone who fitted his coilys, you must always test your work & namely with a car via test drives & if you think your car has never had test drives & charged for the time to do this, then sorry but you're very naive indeed, if my mechanics if I ever use them didnt test my car even in the courtyard of the garage then I'd be worried, things like air filter etc obviously dont require, but suspension etc which are serious components need testing for knocking etc
Each to there own, but rushing through a job like this in 2 hours via single mechanic IMHO creates issues as Jordan found out, prefer someone to be thorough & make sure the jobs 100% than banging it in & hope for the best, I wouldnt use anyone that didnt follow that code as such, audi test drive cars all the time as a matter of course & rightly so.
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AMD Surrey charged 3 hrs to change the springs on my quattro and then alignment on top of that - came to the equivalent of 4 hrs
yeah spot on Dave & I know Simon there fairly well aswell & he wouldnt overcharge, used him for many cars even before he was AMD Surrey, so that to me sounds about right.
I thought it was pretty fair and agree, Simon didn't seem like the kind of guy to try to pull one over on me - he got the car back to me a day late but offered a courtesy car as I had a meeting to get to, didn't take him up on the offer but to offer that without me even trying to raise it as an issue tells me he wants to look after his customers - I will be going back there for any future work. He even remembered me from 5 yrs ago getting my LCR remapped at Mega4/Wheelbase
Midland VW charge 3 hours at £50 an hour inclusive of "basic" alignment which includes adjustment on fronts only. They charge an extra hour if you want the full monty alignment which includes adjustment on all 4 corners which I would definately do on an S3, wouldnt worry about the rears too much on a FWD.
Khufu
Registered User
I'd have said 3 hrs to be on safe side if quoting (kinda hr each front & hr for both rears), assuming things dont come off as easy as they should. We have spent over an hour alone trying to get the top nut off of Ford Fiesta/Ka's as they rust on and you cant even heat the nuts. Test drives are needed as the top mounts can be fine till you touch them & then after refitting they clunk or rub etc or lowering it can cause extra strain on drop links.
EvolutionV
Registered User
Yeah I also know him from those days mate, he's a ****** nice chap, he really is ever so polite & understanding & will go out of his way to help where he can, had my S3 many years ago now mapped at his house round corner lol, bacon butties & tea, met the family, havnt used anyone else since mate & not one issue with any of the cars he's tuned, current 1 has had 2 maps now, 2nd being for custom for my hybrid turbo, flies lol, but whilst doing that he gave me his Brabus Smart & I went round berkshire & surrey for most the day doing work & my stuff, didnt bat an eyelid mate, cant fault him & thats what I call customer service, but TBH sometimes I would pay a little bit extra for peace of mind & service of that level, wouldnt you?
Usually people charge a standing fee for checking it, then further costs for the changes to suit, so what they charge seems fair tbh.
Just reinforces my comments, you dont know what you will find when working on these areas, given its open to the elements/road which by the day is becoming worst with crap everywhere, dirt, weathering etc etc
I prefer realism to false promises mate, so for me thats a fair quote & if they do quicker then maybe they would charge you less, most good garages do anyway.
rickyquicky
Registered User
Sorry who do you think your talking to?
Do you even know what your talking about? Or is it just your mechanic 'mate' with his hand in your pocket?
There is no need to re-align the wheels if you have simply changed the springs. Removing the front struts and replacing them should not move anything out of line. The only adjustment you would ever need to make is camber, but depends how much you lower the car.
If your happy to pay top whack because you think your car is 'special' and requires special setting up after a basic spring swap then more fool you. And learn some manners too :icon_thumright:
And anything over 2 and a half hours is just LOL.
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JamesS4cab
Registered User
Thats cool - 4 hours is the max and they are mates so was just a bit suprised. The reason they quoted me max time is they quoted me 4 hours on the S4 cab......and it took 8!!!
For any of you that know about changing springs on an S4 cab, its quite involved inc dropping the rear sub frame as the suspension mounts are almost impossible to get to due to the location of the storage container for the soft top. I have to admit I actually felt a bit sorry for them!
For any of you that know about changing springs on an S4 cab, its quite involved inc dropping the rear sub frame as the suspension mounts are almost impossible to get to due to the location of the storage container for the soft top. I have to admit I actually felt a bit sorry for them!
Spin140
Registered User
Ben at AVP also quotes 4 hours for springs, when I questioned it he said to do the job properly including alignment this was required.
I asked you a question, I didnt say you were anything or insulted you as such, did I, hence "Are you even Lucid?"
It was more a question in disbelief you would say those things as I personally beleive what you said/saying is wrong, its my POV as you've given yours & who said we were supposed to agree with eachother.
As boycie has said & as you & I both know that the whole hub has to come of which in itself requires the removal of at least 6 bolts/nuts, 3 on the wishbone & 3 on the top mounts, the alignment was setup beforehand based on with the suspension being in this bolted position anyway along with the tie/track rods, none of these bolts/nuts specifically have locators for a fixed position iirc, so the possibility is there for the alignment to have changed as such & it has on few cars of mine & no thats not because of crap workmanship, just these things happen when you come up against hurdles maybe etc etc unforeseen possibles, like driving down the road & alignment gets knocked out somehow huh.
As I said it should be done as a precaution given how small a difference to alignment can make to driving the UK roads.
I havnt proclaimed to be the worlds master mechanic if one at all tbh on this or anyother thread for that matter, but I know this much at least with my very own eyes getting my hands dirty actually doing the work, which most dont, so from my experiences I think you're wrong, but hey everyone's entitled to an opinion on a forum whether we like it or not, others are welcome to do as they see fit with there cars, but I for one will always do alignments after doing this kinda work as I know it does get affected.
I have manners thanks, but again IMHO I feel what you've posted is wrong when doing this specific job anyway.
I dont ever pay top whack thanks, not cause I'm tight, but because I do most of my car work where possible as I like to learn & actually do something for myself instead of paying everyother tom, **** & harry, life would be boring if we all did huh & we'd all broke if paying audis rates, lol.
My car is special, to me
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PaulAr
S3 (8P)
4 Wheel alignment IS required if you swap your springs for `lower`performance items.
I had a set of H&Rs (25mm drop) fitted and was advised by the fitter that 4 wheel alignment wasnt required as the S3 does not have adjustable suspension.
This was wrong advice.
My front tyres had scrubbed off on the insides after just a couple of months. I caught them in the nick of time and although they are still legal (just) I will need to change them soon.
The car was measured at a local fitting centre on a 4 wheel laser alignment which confirmed the geometry was out.
£65 later and an Hrs work and all is well.
If you change your springs then you really need to spend the £50-£100 for a geometry check and alignment.
It will cost a lot more for new tyres if you dont.
My 2p, based on fact and recent experience.
Cheers
Paul
I had a set of H&Rs (25mm drop) fitted and was advised by the fitter that 4 wheel alignment wasnt required as the S3 does not have adjustable suspension.
This was wrong advice.
My front tyres had scrubbed off on the insides after just a couple of months. I caught them in the nick of time and although they are still legal (just) I will need to change them soon.
The car was measured at a local fitting centre on a 4 wheel laser alignment which confirmed the geometry was out.
£65 later and an Hrs work and all is well.
If you change your springs then you really need to spend the £50-£100 for a geometry check and alignment.
It will cost a lot more for new tyres if you dont.
My 2p, based on fact and recent experience.
Cheers
Paul
PH1L
Gievf Buckets
alright just to clarify this, im a neutral party in all of this and i can say 4 hours is a bit much, id expect 3 max including a quick run round the block to get everything settled, with a 4 post lift it takes 15 mins to change the rear springs for any decent mechanic hell i can achive it in this time, slacken a camber adjustment both and remove another springs in bolt it back again. as for teh fronts they do require the shocks to be removed so id say around 45 mins a side for them, however it is possible that the garage can run into trouble, sometimes rust can slow it down a bit and as said there are one or two points that wouldnt nessicarily require 2 bodies but it makes life a lot easier, no garage would charge you for that though as the extra body is required for all of 10 minutes.
having said all that theyve not just bent you over at that cost mate and if the job is done right i'd rather pay for the extra time especially after certain indiviuals have had bother on here. moral of the story is learn to do the job yourself if youre quibbling over 30 quid
and as for the alignment, it isnt required at all the shocks relocate in the exact same position but i would do it anyway for good measure, if your garage has done that theyre clearly usefull and hell id rather they do more than less
having said all that theyve not just bent you over at that cost mate and if the job is done right i'd rather pay for the extra time especially after certain indiviuals have had bother on here. moral of the story is learn to do the job yourself if youre quibbling over 30 quid
and as for the alignment, it isnt required at all the shocks relocate in the exact same position but i would do it anyway for good measure, if your garage has done that theyre clearly usefull and hell id rather they do more than less
PaulAr
S3 (8P)
I agree with this `in theory` and thats one of the reasons I didnt initially bother with the geometry checks. The fitter I used is an experienced guy too and he also advised it wasnt necessary.
However my tyres DID scrub off, and at least one other ASN memeber (Auldreekie) had similar issues.
I wont try and pretend I understand why, and although Im not a mechanic, geometry changes do occur when lowering springs are fitted.
As for how long a spring swap takes, I havent got the foggiest, Ive become a right lazy git in recent years and stick the car in the garage for everything! The important thing is use one that you trust.
Cheers
Paul
JamesS4cab
Registered User
Thanks for all of the helpful responses. There really is no need to fight......................
(Although it is quite entertaining and insightful!!.........)
(Although it is quite entertaining and insightful!!.........)
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you will increase negative camber by lowering, as mentioned this will wear the inside edges of the tire. Also lowering the car will lower the steering rack in relation to the wheels so this will affect the toe.
At the end of the day if you are changing the suspension for performance where is the sense in running geometry anything other that perfect?
At the end of the day if you are changing the suspension for performance where is the sense in running geometry anything other that perfect?
mine took me all friggin day and i was bruised all over, i will never do them again ! 3-4 hours sounds right, its all very well saying 2 hours but what happens if you need to allow a little extra for a stuborn bolt ? and yse my steering needed adjusting afterwards.
any work like that would involve allignment, if not you find out the hard way and costs you more when its chewed your tyres apart, only needs to be a mm out , over both sides which doubles ti to 2mm, thats enough to really shorten the life of a tyre
I'm sure Jenson Buttons crew could do it faster still, but I like to know the guy working on my car was not rushing, and he was given the correct amount of time to check everything.
Maybe we should all rush our day jobs and get home early
Maybe we should all rush our day jobs and get home early
NY_Sportback
Registered User
It took me 4 hours with a helper with pneumatic tools but no lift, i.e. on floor stands and a jack. This was the 3 A3 I've done the swap on so it was a lot quicker then the first 2 that took more like 6-7 hours. not to mention I still had to take the car in for an alignment
Absolutely agree with the post below
I done mine in 2 & 1/2 hrs with only a trolley jack and 2 axle stands in the lovely pissin down Kilwinning weather,& i was runnin around like a mad man outside on my drive,
it is not a hard job to undertake yourself although i would recomend an impact gun as they are gr8 for this job
I done mine in 2 & 1/2 hrs with only a trolley jack and 2 axle stands in the lovely pissin down Kilwinning weather,& i was runnin around like a mad man outside on my drive,
it is not a hard job to undertake yourself although i would recomend an impact gun as they are gr8 for this job
My work would charge 4hours to do this job, takes me bout a hour and half the amount of times i have had them off and on my S3, found it easyer to take the scuttle panel off, did it without doing this the 1st time, but u need to watch u dont crack the scuttle panel, easyer to remove it, everybody has different ways doing things tho
Dont agree with that at all mate, the shocks/wishbone fixings never fit exactly in the same spot as they have no fixed locator lugs & we're talking mm's which make all the difference in alignment terms, so it does matter & it really does need an alignment, but thats all IMHO of course.
PH1L
Gievf Buckets
i was reffering to putting standard springs in, and its always good practice to mark bolt fixings but i do agree with what youre saying, it will need tracking done at a minimum but 4 wheel, doubtfull dependant of the mechanics alignment skills anyway like i said i personally would go over the top but thats the way i am with my cars
Fast,not furious
Dealing with an OCD
Been quoted 3 hours by my local suspension specialist,including 4 wheel alignment....
....will let you know on Friday!:thumbsup:
....will let you know on Friday!:thumbsup:
PH1L
Gievf Buckets
thats not bad at all, im geussing theyre just charging labour for the alignment no additonal fees for that?
waring192
Registered User
Just spoken to my local garage which happen to specialise in Audi and they are doing the following:
Tyres change and disposal: £10 a corner
Springs: 2 hours at £34
ARB's: 1 hour at £34
Alignment: £50 plus up to a hour.
Total: £226
Not bad at all! Just need the parts to hurry up now!
Tyres change and disposal: £10 a corner
Springs: 2 hours at £34
ARB's: 1 hour at £34
Alignment: £50 plus up to a hour.
Total: £226
Not bad at all! Just need the parts to hurry up now!
