Confused HHA+parking brake
- Thread starter Tomo01
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Yep, well on the S-Tronic I'd say anyway.
Stop the car and it comes on, pull away and it comes off. Without it you'd either have to keep your foot on the brake or put the handbrake on each time, bit of a PITA in traffic.
Stop the car and it comes on, pull away and it comes off. Without it you'd either have to keep your foot on the brake or put the handbrake on each time, bit of a PITA in traffic.
But HHA leaves the brake lights on when active.. so I've ended up not using it much at all when it would be useful, i.e. traffic lights, as I can see the driver behind me being blinded.
Maybe I'm too sensitive
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But HHA leaves the brake lights on when active.. so I've ended up not using it much at all when it would be useful, i.e. traffic lights, as I can see the driver behind me being blinded.
Maybe I'm too sensitive
You are yes lol
I can cope with brake lights as there's more to look at, at traffic lights than the person in fronts brake lights.
You can always put the handbrake on to turn the brake lights off, even when HHA is active, if you are there for a long time, or it's night or whatever, to avoid blinding.
Can't get used to sitting there with hand brake on in Drive... so then I put it in neutral... but then it's a pain having to out my foot in the brake to get it back in Drive
Ok.. I don't really find all these things a pain. First world problems. I'll give HHA another go for a few days...
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Quick question - I've ordered HHA on my STronic, never had an auto before. When sitting at traffic lights should you still be putting an STronic into park / neutral, similar to taking putting it into neutral in a manual rather than keeping the clutch depressed? Just wanting to prevent potential wear on the STronic box
FWIW and slightly off topic .... From research before I ordered, I made a few sTronic notes. Probably from this forum, but cannot find to attribute.
Hill hold assist works differently to the parking brake. The ABS module pulses the brakes to prevent rolling, where as the manually activated electronic park brake does what a normal park brake does.
Set the parking brake before you put it in park as it sets the rear brake caliper self ratcheting mechanism and avoids stressing the parking gear pawl/shifter. Also reduces load on the transmission mount.
I've never followed up... i.e. I still always seem to go into Park before putting on the park brake.
Hill hold assist works differently to the parking brake. The ABS module pulses the brakes to prevent rolling, where as the manually activated electronic park brake does what a normal park brake does.
Set the parking brake before you put it in park as it sets the rear brake caliper self ratcheting mechanism and avoids stressing the parking gear pawl/shifter. Also reduces load on the transmission mount.
I've never followed up... i.e. I still always seem to go into Park before putting on the park brake.
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I would have thought it would be worse putting it on before going into park... with it off, the car can roll slightly so the pawl finds a slot, whereas once the handbrake is on it can't
Hill hold assist is great, I wouldn't be without it for £75!! Don't question it!!
You ever have to touch the handbrake again, pulls off automatically... it applies pressure to the brakes when you stop (doesn't apply handbrake). If you turn off the ignition, it puts the handbrake on as you can hear it. If you open the drivers door, it puts the handbrake on.
Brilliant kit for £75 and a must for easy driving. I wouldn't be lost without it, I've driven cars without it since and it's fine but it's such a pain having to hold the brake unnecessarily or apply the handbrake, when the car will do it without you thinking for so little cost.
You ever have to touch the handbrake again, pulls off automatically... it applies pressure to the brakes when you stop (doesn't apply handbrake). If you turn off the ignition, it puts the handbrake on as you can hear it. If you open the drivers door, it puts the handbrake on.
Brilliant kit for £75 and a must for easy driving. I wouldn't be lost without it, I've driven cars without it since and it's fine but it's such a pain having to hold the brake unnecessarily or apply the handbrake, when the car will do it without you thinking for so little cost.
Flying Scotsman
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It makes perfect sense for a manual gearbox....not much for an automatic. In fact it is not available in North America as there is no manual transmission. But, after saying all that, I love a proper handbrake. That silly little push/pull lever is not tactile friendly and removes the art of the handbrake turn!!
It makes sense for both. It works perfectly well in my s-tronic, just as well as it did on my manual car.
RichardT
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But if you haven't got hold assist (nothing to do with hills - Hill Hold is different and is standard on S-tronic) then most people leave their foot on the brake anyway - so no difference really.But HHA leaves the brake lights on when active.. so I've ended up not using it much at all when it would be useful, i.e. traffic lights, as I can see the driver behind me being blinded.
Maybe I'm too sensitive
But you can make that jump anyway by the bearest of touches on the throttle. Will release the brake but not rev the engine. Then just go. Or you can hold the car on the foot brake even when HA is active, but that does take a very gentle touch on the brake.
I didn't really like HA when I first had the car, but now I've learned how to use it I really do. And as others have said it's a no brainer for £75 because you can always just turn it off.
When I was taught to drive (back in the days when drivers considered other drives as well as themselves) I was told in was 'bad manners' to sit there with your brake lights shinning in the following drivers face. So I keep my brakes on when I'm the last car in a queue but when another car stops behind me I put the EPB on and take my foot OFF the brake pedal. Sitting behind a car with it's brakes lights on always used to annoy me (and still does) I said to myself that if ever I drove an automatic I would not sit there my foot on the brake pedal. Unfortunately the Hold Assist just exactly the same as sitting there with your foot on the brake. I had it fitted it in my last A3 but did not use it so I left it off the spec for my current one.
@Tomo01 - More on this topic in the FAQ's
http://www.audi-sport.net/xf/thread...guides-on-the-8v-chassis.198794/#post-2286206
http://www.audi-sport.net/xf/thread...guides-on-the-8v-chassis.198794/#post-2286206
So this the button next to the EPB switch? In NA, we do not have this, would be nice to add if just needing a switch?
I had an S&Tonic equipped car recently, and when I wrote about here I commented on its lack of HHA;
"I'm also very aware that this car doesn't have the £70 option of Hill Hold Assist, and it's ****** irritating. Some say you don't need it with S&Tonic. I disagree."
For £70 its an absolute no brainer, just get it, and if you don't like it, turn it off. The fact is though that although the standard hold assist is good, the Hill Hold Assist option is much better, and is probably the standard bearer in Audi's options lists when it comes to value for money.
As for 'dazzling' people with brakelights? It's a non-issue. I live in London, everywhere I go there is a sea of brake lights. Sometimes I spend hours at a time staring at brakelights, just wishing that someone, somewhere in London would try using their ****** indicators instead, if only for the sake of variety. Despite this supposedly retina searing dose of eyesight endangering levels of red light, I've never ever been 'dazzled' by them...
"I'm also very aware that this car doesn't have the £70 option of Hill Hold Assist, and it's ****** irritating. Some say you don't need it with S&Tonic. I disagree."
For £70 its an absolute no brainer, just get it, and if you don't like it, turn it off. The fact is though that although the standard hold assist is good, the Hill Hold Assist option is much better, and is probably the standard bearer in Audi's options lists when it comes to value for money.
As for 'dazzling' people with brakelights? It's a non-issue. I live in London, everywhere I go there is a sea of brake lights. Sometimes I spend hours at a time staring at brakelights, just wishing that someone, somewhere in London would try using their ****** indicators instead, if only for the sake of variety. Despite this supposedly retina searing dose of eyesight endangering levels of red light, I've never ever been 'dazzled' by them...
Yes that is correct. I'd have thought the harness is already there and its just a plug and play button, with the addition of coding.
Chris43
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My Golf GTD has Autohold (VW definition of HHA) as standard, infact even the base spec Golf has it and Ive got to admit I was gob smacked that Audi don't bundle it as standard equipment with the EPB (E parking brake).
When I ordered my A3 I added HHA without a second thought, £75 is a small price but I still think it should be standard equipment. It really is a neat feature and I would definitely miss it, when my A3 is finally built and delivered.
However. .. a cautionary tale, depending on how Audi configure the interaction of the HHA with the drivers seat belt there can be a potential nightmare. On my Golf (MY13), if I back out of my garage without the seatbelt on the Autohold/HHA does not activate, this means, when i get out to close the garage door the car will roll away unless I manually pull the EPB switch before I get out. Once I'm back in the car after closing the garage door with the seatbelt on Autohold/HHA activates and its all good.
When I ordered my A3 I added HHA without a second thought, £75 is a small price but I still think it should be standard equipment. It really is a neat feature and I would definitely miss it, when my A3 is finally built and delivered.
However. .. a cautionary tale, depending on how Audi configure the interaction of the HHA with the drivers seat belt there can be a potential nightmare. On my Golf (MY13), if I back out of my garage without the seatbelt on the Autohold/HHA does not activate, this means, when i get out to close the garage door the car will roll away unless I manually pull the EPB switch before I get out. Once I'm back in the car after closing the garage door with the seatbelt on Autohold/HHA activates and its all good.
I used to find the HHA was a pain when I was putting the car quite slowly in to the garage as well. The HHA used to hold the car and I needed to apply more throttle than I wanted to get it to release. As I said earlier I switched mine off after a few weeks in the previous A3 and did not order it with the latest one and I have never missed it. As far as brake lights are concerned perhaps it's not so much of a problem in places like London where most areas have street lights. But stopped at traffic light or junction on country roads where the are no lights at all they can feel very bright.
RichardT
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Dave - I don't quite follow what you mean when you say that you "needed to apply more throttle...to get it to release".
On mine you can release the HA by the slightest touch on the throttle, not enough to affect the engine at all.
Some folks advocate leaving the EPB on all the time and just getting it to release by driving forward. I find in that case you need to rev more and you get a jolt when you take off.
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Have to say I love my HHA - and use it all the time (not a fan of the electronic handbrake). The only time that it does get annoying is if you are stuck in traffic on a downward slope you have to accelerate to disengage rather than just roll forward. Minor issue though!
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RichardT
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Again I can't quite see this. Hold assist never needs the engine to speed up from tickover to release - just the bearest touch on the throttle and it releases.
When I am in a queue at traffic lights for example, I look for the lights to change, one touch on the trottle starts the engine, then another touch releases the brake and you start creeping forward on tickover, all without affecting the revs at all.
I haven't seen Hill Hold activate when using Hold Assist. I have a very steep drive joining the road. If I don't have Hold Assist active, then as I stop at the road then release the brake, HH will hold the car for a second before releasing, or if you rev the engine it will release (often with a bit of a jerk). But if HA is active, then it will hold the car on the brake indefinitely until I just touch the throttle (no revving) and the car immediately starts rolling.
I just wonder if sometimes folks get confused between Hill Hold (standard feature with S-tronic) and Hold Assist (option).
Is tapping the throttle once to start the engine and again to release the brake in your example not a FL thing?
Yes, even dealers don't understand the difference between the standard hill hold (which is a standard feature with the EPB) and the optional hold assist.
Have to agree with others for the cost it's fantastic, never have to touch the handbrake. S-tonic + hold assist = one very lazy driver, perfect for that Monday morning commute.
As far as brake lights blinding anyone is concerned; if your irritated with it don't pull up so close. Leave a bigger gap, get out of their boot and the lights will not appear to be so bright.
RichardT
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Perhaps it's different on the FL version. I cannot remember all the reasons I did not like the Hold Assist but I know on my previous A3 I disliked it so I switched it off. On my current one I use the EPB whenever I want to hold the car still. Not too much effort to to click the switch.
One thing I have noticed on my FL is that I need to press the throttle pedal down a little more than I did on my PFL before anything happens so perhaps just tapping the pedal and getting no movement would work better on this one. But I still don't want Hold Assist if nothing else because of the brake lights issue. Each to their own. Again at least Audi give us the option which is more than can be said for some other makers.
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I really wanted HHA on my last 'dealer stock' A3. It was a no from them - they couldn't (or wouldn't) fit it.
I looked into retro fit on the net and found you need a switch, harness and programming so didn't bother.
New car has it and I wouldn't want another car with EPB without it now.
Not much. It's a question of convenience more than anything, but there are some advantages. HHA acts on the hydraulic system, simply locking in the pressure you've already applied when you stopped, so it acts on all four wheels instead of just the rears. Because it's using the ABS module to hold pressure, it's many many times faster to engage and disengage than the handbrake, which is using a motor drive. This makes departures very much smoother. Plus, you don't have to continually flick the handbrake on, which is a big bonus.
So it's not much, but at £70 it's actually very good value for money.
So it's not much, but at £70 it's actually very good value for money.
Probably not. That person is actually the person least likely to use it, since that's exactly the function HHA is carrying out anyway. I'm not sure the designer had a specific person in mind, other than one filling the basic requirements of the rest of car, being designed for the use of humanoids with the standard number of legs, arms and heads.
It's a driver aid, designed for people who like a bit of simplicity and ease of use. In much the same way as high beam assist means you no longer have to go to all that trouble and worry of extending a left finger to dim your lights at night, or S&Tonic saves you from all that irritating business of having to use (or even learn) the key skills of balancing throttle and clutch, or a rear view camera negates the need to look where you're going, or climate control avoids that irritating need to turn the heater up if your feel a bit nippy, HHA avoids you having to the put handbrake on all the time. There's really not much more that can be said about it.
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RichardT
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To be honest I don't think that Hold Assist replaces putting on the hand brake.
When you are in a stop start queue, you really have just keep the car stationary for a couple of seconds - and Hold Assist does this for you. I don't think in all honesty anyone would put the handbrake on and off like that.
However Dave is correct in that when stationary for longer you do tend to rely on HA where you would have otherwise used the handbrake.
When you are in a stop start queue, you really have just keep the car stationary for a couple of seconds - and Hold Assist does this for you. I don't think in all honesty anyone would put the handbrake on and off like that.
However Dave is correct in that when stationary for longer you do tend to rely on HA where you would have otherwise used the handbrake.
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Mines a manual so I have to raise the clutch as well as accelerate - it's not bad it's just not a smooth start to rolling.
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Very well said GSB!
The main reason I was looking to retrofit this to an NA car was the abnormally long traffic lights in the states. This paired with the DSG, is nice to hold the car until pressing the accelerator once the light turns green. Using the EPB works but, as already mentioned, is delayed slightly due to the motor disengaging vs the solenoid powering off in the valve block on HHA.
Sadly, if I do not have a connector for the switch, I doubt I will be able to add this with coding alone.
